L.O.G. 240 We Fear Change

All right. Well, we're ready to go. Everything's on and set up and going. Greg, good morning.

From the frozen, happy baritone. You got a baritone going, Brian. I'm a little got a little head cold going right now, but I got enough of that Advil Cold & Sinus with the pseudoephedrine in there to at least make it through this podcast episode. So I apologize to everyone.

That's ambitious. You're supposed to grind it up and smoke it, right? I mean...

Well, you hold the aluminum foil. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what he did. Put the put the straw in my mouth. That's called Bad Lieutenant, by the way.

Well, so that's what I have going on, folks, for those listening. But thank you for everyone tuning in. And today, we're talking about, in general, how people fear change and what that means and what that entails with our reactions to certain situations. Just in general, kind of below the surface, that we don't realize what's happening. Anytime a new idea, a new policy, a new thing comes out, something changes that we're not used to, we have an inherent sort of fear of change because we are primed to seek out familiarity because familiarity has kept us alive, right?

So, if you're alive today listening to this episode, you know, you've made it this far and your brain goes, "Okay, if we've made it this far, so if we keep doing what we've always done, we're likely to continue to survive and then continue to procreate and populate the species and be contributing members to society and all that." So, so it's just a very easy way without getting into the full science of the limbic system and how your different catecholamines kind of force you to think that way, but is very simply put is: we fear change because we don't like uncertainty and we seek familiarity. So I wanted to start it there because we're going to get into a whole bunch of different examples, Greg, but I just want to sort of frame the episode with that. And I think there was even a Wayne's World quote where he was in there and they started talking about, because they got the sponsor for the show and then he was like, "What? What do you mean we're going to have a sign that comes down? We fear change!" But I still, it just popped into my head as I thought as I said, "We fear change."

We were talking a couple of years back. You and I were doing yet another film shoot somewhere, doing something, and a guy came up and said, "How do you think you make such accurate predictions?" And the point was well taken because we're in a big old parking lot and I said, "You see this car over here? That was the furthest away from the entrance of any of the stores, and it was parked under a tree." And I said, "There's no shade now." I said, "But there will be shade at about what time?" And the guy looked around and goes, "I don't know, like 5, 5:30." And I go, "Okay, what's happening then?" And he goes, "Shift change." I go, "So where does this guy work?" And he goes, "Well, probably one of those stores over there where the car is pointing." And I said, "Yeah, exactly. But nobody else parked here. Only the people from that store. Everybody else would park where?" And he goes, "Well, up front where everybody else is." I said, "Yeah, and they'll circle around the block passing up viable options to choose the one that's closest. Why? Because we don't want stress or anxiety. We seek out the pack. We seek out the familiar and we want to feel less fear. So what is fear? Fear is the one of the best internal mechanisms to avoid danger and it's hardwired into all of us. And as anxiety increases going towards fear, it's meant to tell us, 'Hey, for every step you take out on the ice, it's getting thinner.' It's our unconscious speaking to us through a very simple electrochemical response to warn us of things that could happen. So it's simpler, it's safer, you burn less calories.

And we see it all the time when we host in-person classes. The people come in on the first day and they sit down and they start talking. And then all of a sudden Brian has to come up and go, 'A couple of administrative notes, you got to move into this area.' Do they love moving? No, oh no, they hate moving. Now, in the other courses where we allow them to sit wherever they want and then the next day we play on, 'Hey, take a look at where you sat today.' There was no structure, but you repeated the behavior. Why? Because now you feel a sense of comfort in that choice. And you immediately take ownership of that because that's the first thing I was... And we tied into what we're talking about that day, but I was saying, 'Why did you sit in this chair after you got up, went to lunch and you came back and stayed in the same spot?' He's like, 'Well, that's my seat.' It's like, 'Well, this isn't anyone's seat. This is not your classroom. It's not this, you don't own it.' But you immediately take ownership of that and you go back to it. And just because you know, it's and you've already burned those calories too, Brian. You've already made the choice by coming in the room and your spatial arrangement said that I like to be a little further. I'm not so distant.

And so back to the guy in the parking lot that asked that question, the reason I said that is to preface this story about a guy we both know that was the one that didn't sit in the same seat. And he sat in random seats all over the place, and seats we wouldn't have expected. So the thing that sticks out to us is the one that doesn't follow the pattern, the one that willfully or wantonly chooses something different. And I'm not talking arbitrary or capricious you wander around and fall down because you're drunk or you're high. I'm saying where a person intended deliberately to choose and sit somewhere. And that's that if if that's true, then that's a perfect demonstration that people fear change. Why do I park where I park? Why do I sit where I sit?

And it's not just about fear too. I mean, if you think about it from that classroom example, because you started to allude to it when you brought that up, but the idea was, "Okay, I, this is where I'm sitting." One, my brain doesn't want to then have to find another seat, right? Look around and now it has to take in all this information, but that's that's two reasons. One, it seeks familiarity, but in that specific context too, it's like, "Hey, I want to hurry up and get back and sit down. I my brain's locked into what's going on here. I don't need, I don't want to deal with anything else in the room right now because I'm focused on what's happening here." And so it goes to what it already knows. And now if if someone else had had sat there, you know, while I was taking a piss or something like that, and I come back in, now that literally gives anxiety.

Mother of God.

I gotta go find a different spot. You know, and you're getting pissy because you're maybe now is going to be a confrontation, right? I mean, there's so many reasons. And so that's why you then kind of sort of juxtapose or use that as a comparison to someone who deliberately then, "Well, no, I'm going to go move over here." Well, there's there's intent behind that. That doesn't that doesn't fit that what what what that that doesn't fit the groove in the record.

Now, they may be doing that for their own reason that I don't know, right? They will, "The sound is better over here. I can't see from this position." But but the the the it's counter to what a typical person would do given the set of circumstances, which is why it rises above the baseline, we go, "That's odd. There's something here." Because you you have to have some thought input into that, unless, like you said, there's some drug interaction or something where they don't even know where it's not their, or or it's their third or fourth thing that they get to. So it's not deliberate, right? It's unintentional.

So.

So if we take a look at why are we bothered, right? Martin, our dear friend and overseas program adviser, was talking about having roads blocked and "those wankers, I should go out there." Well, a way of protest now that's very popular, it's always been a sit-in, but now it's a sit-in on the freeway or on a roadway, and actually put quick dry concrete your hands to the ground or something, which is going ridiculous, right? But but why does that work? Because once we've set a pattern, we're going to repeat the pattern. We're not going to change things. Okay, so so so that's why safety, let's talk to all the people in Safety and Security that we know. You want to set a pattern with your kid walking them to school until they can take the reins and walk themselves to school, and they know the pattern and they come back. But in Safety and Security, and anti-kidnapping and child everything, knock on the van, what you want to do also is make sure that they understand alternative routes and every once in a while switch it up.

Well, that's the same thing with a business executive or anybody that is going out to start their car, start it at a different time, park it in a different way. I live in the middle of nowhere and have no neighbors, even the lawn and in the docker way down the street, but I park the truck in a different manner every day because I figure if somebody is watching me, they'll go, "Hey, somebody lives there and the guy's queued in because he's moving the orientation of the vehicle all the time." Now, as ridiculous as that seems, that's a hard pattern to get into, okay? Because it's counterintuitive. Our intuition tells us to relax, everything's fine. It's just a balloon popping in the mall, sit down, you'll live longer. I mean, we have this steady stream of (unintelligible) going through the the the back of our brain that's, you know, the the program, the hidden program on our computer that's constantly running and going, "Don't worry, I'll do the update tonight when you're asleep." Yeah, that's the problem with our survival, isn't it? Because what we do is we rely on those age-old things, but the challenges are different. For example, we have too much communication now and too much information. So what does that do? That shuts people down when it comes to face-to-face talking, right? So so there's a balance, Brian. There's there's a reason things evolve over time, and anytime that you try to to to jump-start that or change it drastically, there's going to be pushback, there's going to be confusion, and there's going to be anger, right? So so we have to be careful about that because people fear those things when they change quickly.

No, and and and, yes, and and and because, you know, we feel like we're wait, "Hey, I just got used to everything. You're getting the rug pulled out from under me. There's some uncertainty. I'm not sure." And it's just a natural defense mechanism for all humans to say, "Wait a minute, we don't like this. What does this mean? I I don't know." Like, you know, we have a certain pattern that we're supposed to follow because it's worked for us. And so part of that anxiety can can, you know, and and the, which is interesting, because within those periods of change or something's happened, there's actually can be a significant amount of opportunity within that, right? We always do the danger, opportunity, because those are two two sides of the same coin, right? Yes, it can be, "I don't know, maybe my job's on the line. I'm not sure how this company reorg is going to go and what's going to happen." But it could also mean, "Wait a minute, I could also capitalize on this and take on a new role or higher pay or more responsibility." So so we don't often look at it that way.

And and, you know, because we naturally fear that, you sort of have have to take that into account when making changes. So so you have to determine like, why are we making changes to this situation, to this policy, to this procedure, this way of doing things? And if I don't, you know, and a lot of things are missed sometimes because that's not clearly articulated on why this needs to change, or it becomes a knee-jerk reaction, and, "Well, the public wants this, and so now we have to do that." It's like, "Well, well, is that the best thing? I mean, why why so have we done any sort of analysis as to say, here's why we're changing this. Here's the purpose behind it. Here's..." because everything, that's the one thing that's constant, right? Things are constantly changing, right? Things are constantly adapting, they're constantly evolving or devolving or or whatever, that's just nature, that's that's that's biology. I don't care about even before you even get to different social issues or something, I'm just talking about innate in nature, things constantly adapt and change. That's the way it's always been. There is no steady state. It's a constant state, it's the state is constantly in flux, is is what it is. And so...

But it has to be, you're because that's the thing, you're either you're either what? You're either evolving or devolving. You're either getting stronger, faster, you know, harder to kill, or your your species is dying off. It's one or the other. Like you can't just maintain. Like you have to do one or the other.

And so so I I I think we we almost forget that sometimes as humans because we become sort of sedentary in thought and and and belief that we we were not used to that constant change. So if you're not doing it correctly, and what we're kind of getting into right, is is if if I don't have a reason for it that I can justify, then it it's going to be difficult to accept that change.

Let let me give you a couple of instances, real-time instances from my history. Gosh, we got to write another textbook. First of all, Bird Flu. I was part of the team that had to listen to the plan of the politicians to close down the roads, close down the town, the people that lived out of town. We were taking their propane and the food out of their fridges and freezers to survive because we're going to create this biodome of just humans living off the grid. This was the plan for a county in a state to counter the Bird Flu and have armed insurrection to make sure that we took over the roads and turned people away. And would deadly force be authorized? Well, certainly, because, you know, this is a dangerous situation. And I said, "Okay, this is a a point in my career that I have to make a mark because I can't believe the things coming out of people's mouth."

And the plan happened again. Y2K. I still in the basement have a flag that looks like the Swiss flag. It's a dark green flag with a white cross in it because I was designated as one of the people that understood how to survive after Y2K and I was supposed to take part of this government group and put them in a place in a state and take care of them till things got back to normal. And that flag was designed for those people, where where to go. The things I heard and the things I saw that build up to Y2K, Brian, why? Because they scared us. All the things that you take for granted every day, the rug is going to be pulled out from under you and it's going to be different. Look at the tension. People died. Think back to just 2019 when people died in stores because somebody got in an argument with them over wearing a mask or not wearing a mask or being too close and not too, and it turned into a shootout. Why? Because we were afraid. The bottom line was that we were afraid. We we fear those things that we don't understand. And when we assume, we make assumptions that some sort of plan is is nigh, that some somebody has a plan for it. And then all of a sudden we have the government coming on and going, "Uh, no, none of us figured out that when it goes to zero, things might reset." Right? Then we're even more afraid because we think, "Well, somebody had to be looking at this, say uh doors closed, doors locked or unlocked." You vote a report. Let's go to any situation of mass chaos. And what do we do? People say, "Well, wasn't there a plan?" Well, kind of, you know what I'm saying? And and we were kind of thinking, "Well, this would never happen here. Lightning never strikes."

So so Brian, we fear things that we think are going to change without like like for example, climate change is always going to happen because when you have a closed system and you insert something to that system like the world and humans, something's got to change. So if you add or remove a species or you add or remove a metal or a gas or something from a system, something's got to come out of that. So we like slow, well-thought-out change. We hate abrupt, take it or leave it, knee-jerk reaction change.

Yeah, that's all human, that's across the world, I think. And that's that's a a great point because it, I mean, even ties back to, you know, that's the old New Year's resolution thing, right? People trying to do too much. It's like, no, slow, incremental is going to be better over time.

Why do people fight aggressively after the first handcuff is applied, more so than at every other point that it just got real? It's so...

So you mean I'm going with you?

Yeah, you mean my freedoms are now gone? I heard you say that, but I didn't really sink in until... Never dawned on me.

And that's a perfect example, right? It never dawned on me until all of a sudden that first handcuff clicks and it's like, "It's on." So so we have to know that as humans, being good humans to other humans, we have to know that and we have to, I guess, prepare prepare for the inevitability of change. I told you about a death that we had. We had three very recent in Gunnison, all good friends, all people that were way too young to die. Why did it bother us so much? Because we never expected it. Yeah, and it was an abrupt change that was handed to us and we had nothing to say about it, nothing to do about about it. So I I mean, we're following a theme.

Yeah, and the and the theme is that we like having part in our decision-making. We, when anxiety goes up, we tend to like, "Our show is canceled," or, "A new show comes on," or, "They jumped the shark," and there's new characters. It can be something as little as that, Brian. It can be something that a Pepsi Free, or there's a New Coke, right? So it doesn't have to be a world-altering change to be a Brian or a Greg-altering change. I think that's important as well.

Yeah, and and so one of the things that you you you have to do, I think, when implementing change is, um, you know, have some sort of analysis as to why you're doing it. Like, what what is the point here? Uh, what what is the reason for it? Um, and and what do we get out of making these these policy changes, these procedural changes, these daily habit changes, right? Because you have it has to have some sort of, there there there, if there's no reason and you're just doing it as you you like to say, willy-nilly, um, you know, then then what do what can you possibly expect out of it? You know, I mean that you're you're just absolutely, you're you're creating turbidity for people. You're creating chaos and anxiety. For for what?

For what? Turmoil is a good thing, okay? Agitation is a good thing. Anger is a good thing. But but having it for not, that's where the danger lies, right?

Right. That that's where you're going to lose people in the company. That's where you're going to alienate people in the family or or your your spouse or significant other, right? Because it's like, what's this arbitrary choice? Why why are we now doing these things this way? And and I think that people get along when they know it's coming, when they understand the reasons behind it. Even if it isn't their choice, at least they get an idea to look inside that fabric and go, "Okay, I I guess I see what's going on." That's a lot better than just saying, "By the way, tomorrow all that you knew is gone." By the way, gravity gone. We don't do it that way.

Yeah, Slim Shady. "You know, there goes gravity." I mean, what a great line, okay? Because his whole world changed in that moment, you know.

Yeah, no, and that that's that's a great point because it's it's, uh, if if you don't if you don't prep people for that, um, then it can be that rude awakening and and you can you can have a really negative effect or you can do it correctly and sort of implement change over time and explain why it is and then one, it becomes easier. People go, "Oh, wow, I see the benefits of this. This is a good thing." And you're getting people involved, right?

I would say when you use the word correctly, use correctly with the little quotation marks because the great thing about science and the great thing about law is laws can be repealed. You can go to the government with redress. Science, the best thing about being a scientist is when I'm faced with new information and it's been validated, vetted and tested, then I can change my opinion. That that's the beauty of this. Yes. So when you say, "Hey, you know, this is a thought-out change and we're doing it," that doesn't mean that you can't come back at some point or change or alter that. That just means that there's a process, and I think process makes it better. You know, we're we're we're going through a procedure, we see the benefits here and we're going to alter or adapt. It's with (Charles Darwin), the HMS Beagle guy, Origin of Species, that's what.

Yeah, Darwin.

Darwin. That's literally Darwinism. What he wrote about is these things are going to happen. Take a look at how they happen a little at a time. And what also do we know about history? We also know that there's certain points in history that are still hazy, that we don't understand very well because there's a big jump in time. The spacetime changes and all of a sudden something that that usually takes a million years to do happen in a hundred thousand or happen in 10,000, and that's still amazing too. So there's adjustments you got to make, right?

Yeah, yeah. And so I I think speaking of adjustments, we'll get into what what the hell we're talking about, yeah, today too because this is, um, we're we're sort of transitioning from, uh, male to female. Welcome to the party. You never expected it, did you? That's too, that's too much. That's the Bill Burr too much.

That's a Bill Burr joke. He's like, "Look, wait, we're not supposed to talk about this. If I run into my buddy and the last time I saw him he had a mustache and he shaved his mustache since I've seen him, that's a 10-minute conversation right there. That's huge, right? We're not supposed to talk about this stuff over here."

No, we we're going from the, uh, so it's it's from The Human Behavior Podcast to just The Human Behavior Podcast. And so for those of, especially our Patreon subscribers, I've been going back and forth on this and getting feedback, but the idea was, you know, we're taking this show is, this is sort of the last episode of The Human Behavior Podcast, and going to the next phase, the next step, as it's grown and adapted. And you know, we we've always, we've done this for a while. First it started out just to get our stuff out there, get people listening, um, and and and as sort of a marketing tool, just for our work that we could talk about it because because our stuff, this long-form conversation, it suits our work better than the 30-second clip that you can watch and know what it is. Because sorry, well, that's it's not simple. So simple things take 30 seconds to understand in a promo video, but ours doesn't. And that's fine.

So it allowed it to to get it out there. And and there was other reasons too. There's a lot of people out there, um, purporting to be things that they weren't, or, you know, using information that wasn't theirs. And so the point was, well, we're just going to get on and talk about all that because that'll put them, you know, the people realize that they're they're not they're not who they they claim to be. And that that all worked, and actually it worked faster than I thought in terms of some of the stuff of people reaching out and going, "Hey, I'm interested. I want to learn more." So that was the original goal. And then we use it to talk about different subjects that that, you know, it's it's what it was, it was our conversations that we had in in the car, over dinner about certain uh news items, about certain concepts, about the way people perceive things. So it was a window into how we think and approach things that I think people really appreciated. And it started to grow, and we, which we appreciate everyone listening right now, it's been been great. We have great feedback. But, you know, we had to, and we've been sort of meaning to do this for a while or give the podcast more effort and time and meaning behind it versus us coming on and keeping it very casual, um, we wanted to kind of step the game up a little bit. And and because it's naturally progressed that way anyway with some of the conversations, with some of the people we've had on, with some of the questions we get from our listeners, which are all fantastic. So we really want to make it into what what it is.

And so so that's what we're doing. And and so, which is why we started the whole 20 minutes of talking about fear and change and what can become because, um, we're both really excited excited about this. I'm super excited about it because one of the things that we're going to be doing is, because we do travel so much, we said, "Well, why don't we just lean into this?" And we're doing this anyway is we can go to different places and, you know, rent the, you know, a nice high-end podcast studio to record the episode in and get good video and all that kind of stuff, and really kind of get up the production value and things like that. And and make sure we're interacting more with our listeners and providing more content and even more stuff that's going to be happening on the Patreon. So the Patreon side is going to be really what we want to create is is that feedback from those folks listening and that have questions that we can dive into this. So so we want to keep the podcast episodes that we have on here and continue to do for free that accessible to as many people as possible to really listen into that and open up the audience and go, "Wow, I never considered that perspective." And then for you folks, I know that have been listening and following along and their Patreon subscribers, like we're going to have those subscriber-only episodes. We're going to have those Q&A stuff on there. The Patreon is going to be a big thing for us because that way we get more feedback from you, more interaction, and we can really dive into some specifics on things that probably wouldn't play well over the the the podcast, but or and that we would want to honestly keep, you got to keep the riff raff out and one way to do that is charge people a few bucks. And that automatically that automatically keeps a lot of the the people that are just trolls and want to talk (unintelligible), it kind of keeps them away because now they have to actually put in some effort. They're not willing to do that. Um, so so that that's part of it and and that's kind of the big announcement for today's episode, um, and wrapped in this this overall theme. So I'll let you kind of kind of...

So here's the thing, folks, if right now you're going, "Wow," well, think of me. Brian came and said, "It's time." And it was a really, really, really, really, really hard transition for me, probably six months because the idea was I was one of those things saying, "Look, early adopters, we don't want to lose people." This, yeah, and then, you know, it dawned on me one day when I'm ready to go out and walk the dog that, you know, we've outgrown The Human Behavior Podcast. And and the reason we've outgrown The Human Behavior Podcast is because The Human Behavior Podcast has always been an inside joke between Brian and I and a very small community. And, you know what? And then grown, yeah, well, that's the thing. And our listeners are in on it. And it's such a big community now. Yeah. So so the thing is that what we talk about each time we get together is human behavior. So simply call it "The Human Behavior Podcast" was a given. The second thing is we don't use structure. We very rarely, as a matter of fact, many many of the episodes, and Brian, how many episodes are we up to? This will be 240.

Yeah.

So 240. Think about that for a minute. Most podcasts go away after 30, okay? There's some that last till 50. So this is a milestone. But the idea, meaning that many times Brian and I are like, (unintelligible), "We got to do a podcast for the week." So we batted around and we go, "What what are some of the topics that we'd like to do?" No longer. What we're going to do is based on like Brian said, not only feedback, but current events, uh, science, some of the things that we can't cover in class that we'd love to take more. Now we can relegate those to to the podcast. And also just simply from a marketing standpoint, it's really hard to look through a list of podcasts and there's a lot out there.

Yeah.

And The Human Behavior Podcast says nothing. Yes, unless you're in on the joke. Yeah, whereas "Human Behavior" will kind of get you there a little bit quicker. So, and look, we're we're taking we're taking a chance, but it's not an unmeasured chance and it's not a Brian has put a a tremendous amount of thought into it and had to carry me both ways for a lot of months. And then the last couple of months when we take a look at it, made a lot more sense. And then the last couple of episodes and the last couple of weeks. So, you know what? I think it's the right thing to do. Brian does. Most of the people that we've bounced it off that we have a a tremendous amount of faith and and uh we understand their capability and what they know, they like it. So let's let's give it a shot. And with your help, with everybody that's listening or watching right now, we can make this a good thing. I mean, I'm excited because I think the first six months have so much ready there, so much in the line. We we always underpromise and overdeliver anyway, if you know us, you know that's exactly what you're going to get here. But it's not just a bunch of uh of scattershot. This is a measured, tempered approach to get us to that next level of professionalism that we need uh to get the message to to more people and make sure that the message is laser-focused every time.

Well, and and the other reason too, and I appreciate giving sort of the the background of of what what the podcast was and is, and it's actually always been separate. Like I've been doing the podcast as a separate thing. And we even tell people, "Look, it's like our opinion-based testimony, check it out." You know, we don't, um, which is talking well and and there's different re there's a number of different reasons that I I kept it that way. We we decided that, um, but but now as it's been it's progressed, it's like we're having there's a lot we can do with it. So we have to bring it to now it's it's The Human Behavior Podcast. It's part of Acadia Coga. It's not a separate thing. This is what we're going to be discussing. It's just going to be a lot more deliberate. And so we can still do our subscriber-only ones of just us talking about different, you know, topics like we do. Um, but but yeah, it's definitely going to be more deliberate and and concise about how we address certain things and why we talk about them the way that we do. And I think that will actually open it up to folks and get even better feedback. And we've already gotten some great stuff from especially like I said, the Patreon subscribers and different listeners and who who we love and appreciate. So we want to not just have been our guinea pigs.

Many, yes. Well, ideas, textbook, Brian. I mean, and and early adopters, early adopters are always rewarded. So we always take care of people who have who have, you know, glommed on and been a part of it for a while.

Um, but the other the other the other thing is with with this is that, you know, I I getting having people involved like that is where I tried to want to go to. It just it's a time time-consuming thing. But we kind of have a better way to do it. And and there's going to be things that we can get into. But, um, having those folks that you guys listening and and that that, you know, really kind of give us that feedback is so crucial and helpful and powerful. Um, because that that makes it better. And so we want to make sure we're delivering you guys the best stuff possible. And and by being more deliberate about it and changing it up a little bit, that's going to help us do that. So I think I think people will actually the the original listeners who've been having for a while will like actually even appreciate it even more, I think. Um, that that's what that's what my goal is because those are the ones that have been telling us to keep going and and reaching out to us. So I I definitely want to make sure that they're...

Brian, what aren't they losing? They're not going to lose us. It's it's not as if Morgan Freeman is going to play Greg on the next episode. Gilbert Gottfried has always been me. That's going to do the voiceover. They're not going to lose our our sense of humor or our comic timing. What they're going to do is they're going to get an episode that has enough structure to make sure that we can fully and thoroughly talk about some of these topics that that are really of interest to people. Because many times we had a default to white belt, which is not a bad thing. But assuming that people knew stuff and then all of a sudden people are going like, "We have no idea about that. That's going a little fast." We and so we don't want to do that anymore. We want to make sure that the folks that tune in get a full they get a beginning, a middle and an end, Brian. And when they walk away, they go, "Hey, we got something." So don't fear that you're losing anything. You're losing a name. So we don't want to lose you as a customer, as a client, as a friend. But you're going to gain so much. Look, I I liken it to the textbook. Never liked the idea of writing a book. Never. After Left the Band came out, even less that I want to write a book because everybody was going the wrong direction. But the textbooks, the right direction. Look what you get with the textbook. You get the textbook and then you get the the online edition. And then you have links to different stories that Brian and I tell and different things that we filmed. Brian, that cornucopic advancement is exactly what we're going to do with the podcast. The podcast is going to be so much richer in fidelity field and deeper and we just can't do that with the old format. It it's just, you know, we I think the easiest way for me to understand it in my own mind is we outgrew The Human Behavior Podcast and that this change is is here now and it's coming.

Yes, and and that's, um, and I have to thank our listeners for that too. We definitely did because those people sharing the episode and sharing this, um, you know, if you put up with 240 hours of Brian and I, because I know people that binge, I know people that comment on old episodes, I know people that that say, "Hey, you always said you were going to follow up on this and you haven't."

Brian, there's so much there, so much amazing opportunity, right? That that I can't wait to to to dig again.

Well, and and then we have some of that stuff to base it off of too. Like we can go back to those past episodes where people have reached out about stuff and just reformat the content in a sense to go, "Well, let's let's dive into these deliberate areas." So so get rid of half the stuff we talked about in that episode and stick to these these areas that this is what time talk.

Yeah, we have everyone's got the the feedback from what what would these were the questions on it and that's why we we really appreciate it. Um, from us.

So, and the updates too, Brian. There were certain things that changed in certain cases that four or five years later now the outcomes were different and stuff.

I'm excited about being able to go back and talk about those things in the light of time. Now we have that distance and time from it that we can look back and and and say we can evaluate the things that we said then and, you know, put them in a frame for today's listener.

Yeah, and and some of the episodes too will come with with different stuff that we've written up before in the past and kind of the inside, like everything from personal stories to photos and stuff like that of where we're at, so you can get a little bit more behind the scenes kind of stuff or where this stuff comes from and and read read into that, which will be great for some of those takeaways for for people to really make it sticky. Um, and that's that's sort of the the goal here with that. And, you know, it you this is why we started the episode with, um, evolving and adapting and changing and how it's constant, because as long as it's going in the right direction, you're evolving, not devolving, right? Then then it's it's going to get better over time iteratively. And that's been the goal. And we didn't do that after three episodes. We didn't do that after 30 episodes. We did it after almost 300 episodes. So what does that mean? Like we we we've found an algorithm that works, but then how do we how do we tighten that shot group up? Okay, we're hitting the target right from from far away, but but we can always get a tighter shot group.

And so that that's the that refinement over time and that iterative uh refinement over time with feedback and analysis and and discussing the the concepts, not just that we're going to talk about, but discussing the impact it has because one of the things that we do, um, obviously in person is is the best type of training you're going to get. And what you get, you know, you can do so much more and you can go to so many different places when when it's online or on social media or even listening here, it's different. So you you have to account for that. And, you know, it's it's difficult sometimes for me anyway, I can speak to myself, to go, how is this going to get across to the listener, right? What I want to make sure our intent is clear. And some people have told me like, "Hey, you're worried about like turning people off or pissing people off too much." And it's like, no, that that's not what it is. I actually don't care if someone doesn't like what we say. I really don't. Like go on, there's plenty of other podcasts. If anyone follows on social media, my Instagram response is always like, "Hey, that's awesome. Thanks. Uh, there's like a billion Instagram accounts out there. Maybe this one isn't for you. Hope hope you find what you're looking for," because I don't care about that. I am very concerned or or my concern is my focus is is the intent of our message coming through? Is that part clear? Because as long as the intent is clear, if you know, I I I say the wrong word because you're talking all day long or or I mention the wrong thing, like you you get the intent behind it. And that's that's that's the most important part.

And that's always been my concern with this. And it's not like not that I'm wor that it's not meaning it's that's that's the point, that's the focus, because a lot of people now, you know, you brought it up at the beginning when you said there's a lot of information out there, there's so much communication, there's so much this. And I don't think people take the because it's so simple and because we've been doing it so much now, people just fire off with stuff and they just send out comments and they just send out (unintelligible) and they don't think about what they're do they're not being deliberate. And I think that contributes to the sort of dumbing down of societ society. Like don't like you're just going to recycle some old (unintelligible), you're just going to post someone else's thing, you're just going to like no, like be deliberate. Why are you doing this? You know, not everything is is weighted equally. And and I that's just my own thing. Everyone who's, you know, any social media guru expert who would give you advice or consulting on it would say, "No, just (unintelligible) put it out there. Fire away. Just keep going." And I don't want to do that. And and I I think that's (unintelligible) (unintelligible). I think it's stupid and I think it makes us all dumber. And you can't constantly put out top quality, you know, and you know, top quality content. Right? We're not always going to hit a home run, but at minimum, I gotta get on base. Like, you know what I'm saying?

No meg episode, that's that's our goal. No meg episodes. Every once in a while, those are good though, to to throw in there just to completely go off track. See if somebody's paying attention.

You you do have to change it up. But I I I hope that makes sense to you, Greg. Do you get what I'm saying with with how the message comes across too?

Yeah, listen, everybody that knows me knows that I would have never ever considered having a podcast, ever, as Brian's baby always has been, same thing about the book. That's just not me. My goal is to take a knee with a bunch of kids at the corner on a sand lot and play a game of baseball and teach them about physics that way. But the problem is that's not going to get the mass appeal and not going to get the feedback that are necessary. Now there's people at the other end of the spectrum that can't shut the fuck up. And and a lot of the stuff that they're pushing out uh uh in lieu of content is just word salad. Yeah, and we're trying to counter that as well. And you know what, folks, to to get to almost 300 hours of of speaking and making sure that it's legal, moral, ethical, and it find you know, it reaches, it breaches and reaches a scientific threshold is not easy. And so we're saying to you that Brian and I are all in, all the time. We just doubled down and it's going to be better from this day forward and we're going to continue that improvement, the laser focus, the fidelity search to make sure that what you're getting is the clearest, most cogent content out there. And and so the name, you know, it may change but this suit coat won't, we know that. Yeah, so don't fear this change. And we we gosh, the preamble on this one, Brian, was long in detail. I don't know if we, I don't know if we if we got everyone. Were they, did we we make the fear worse when we drop the information or do we did we abate it? We exacerbate or abate? That's so funny.

Well, you know what the the best way is to tune in and see. Like there's still some things I'm not sold on, uh, you know, the the production quality versus the content. But, you know, what has to happen because if somebody's going to tune in and listen for a long period of time, uh, we've got to make it better. And and Brian and I are always on the road, uh, but that's a dodge when it comes to not delivering. Uh, so we've done our best even through the holidays and even through tough times to make sure that we get out there with a good episode, not a meg episode. And we're going to continue that. We're just going to raise the standards. And and by raising our internal bar, you're going to reap the benefits. That's the great thing. We're not asking one more thing of you.

No.

And and I think I think that's that's, you know, we we owe that to the listeners, you know, for for just being responsible with how we conduct ourselves and do things. But I I think that's pretty much everyone sort of expects that and that's our standard we've set already even with this the way we've done it now, right? Um, and and and the, you know, the other thing is I we've this has been an incredibly powerful learning tool for us and especially for me, um, because it's changed the dynamic of even some of our in-person training and how things are where we're we're coming in sometimes now where people do know us or have listened to the podcast and so we're almost the in to me when that happens, the the training is even better because it's like we're moving faster. There's no...

Yes, we we get to push the envelope. We get to get more in because people are kind of they're used to our rhythm and they're used to hearing us and so they assimilate the information faster.

Just notes, they come with questions.

Come with questions.

Or they come, yeah, they come with questions and they get the, you see the oh, the recognition on some people's faces when we talk about something, they're like, "That's what you meant in that episode where you talk about this," which is so cool because then they can refer back to that and it's like they were they did the pre-learning before we even showed up. They didn't without even knowing it. And that's the really cool part too is is how that that's changed. I love that. That's really interesting because, um, you know, we we we get to, we like we said, it just makes the in-person training uh better. And then those who hadn't heard of us, now that we have we do the in-person training, it's like they can keep listening to the podcast afterwards and it's free. And they're basically getting, you know, you're you're reinforcing some of the concepts that they learned, you know, in some new light with some new case, with some new thing that happened.

Or 140 hours of different stories of perspective than fidelity. So it's it's really I think it's it's really helped a lot and I think for a lot of folks have really liked it. So so we want that's part of the reason we absolutely want to keep it up too because it it's fun that way and and like I said the feedback is everything and and we rely on you folks that are listening right now to kind of just reach in and shoot us an email and go, "Hey, could you cover this or or what about this or I'm not sure about this question or I'm not sure about what you meant when you said this?" Um, and and we're going to we're going to try and do less of the uh the big one were for some people who have were like, "Hey, can you guys put out like a glossary of terms because you guys use so many different," but there were funny ones. There a lot of them were Greg-isms like calling a car a sled. Like, you know what I mean? Or or certain things like that, which which you you you can figure out from the context of the conversation, but but all the...

Yeah. But but it's it's it's funny like those little colloquial terms that that we we fall back on, um, you know, you got to be like, "Ah, yeah, you got to pay attention." That that someone out there just tuning in is like, "What the fuck are you talking about, dude?" Like when we get someone who's reached out and been like, "Hey, I was really interested, but I was also unsure about this other stuff, but it sounds like you guys really know what you're talking about." Right? And it's like, okay, I got it. I got you. I got you. But you have to balance that without what you said, like, you don't want to go too slow and alienate those people that do listen to us who have such a great knowledge base because that's the thing is like our audience is not for everyone. Well, but it's not for everyone. It's not everyone. And I don't want our podcast to be anyone could listen to this. You have to be interested in this material.

Exactly. But the the that, hence the name change is the first standard. But my promise is we're never going to get too big for our britches. Weight-wise, maybe, weight-wise, maybe I'm going to be stretching the limit of my pants and my belt and my shirt buttons, but when it comes down to it, that's not our goal here. Our goal is to make sure that each episode is more robust and and the detail is there, so you have those things that like for for every time that I said, "Do your homework," well, we're going to do some of that homework for you now. Yeah. And we're going to you know, help you down certain paths, so you can have the realization that we did, you know, decades ago, and and Brian, I'm I'm excited. The journey has been amazing to this point. That's what people don't get. It's been an amazing journey to today.

Yeah, I can only imagine what it's going to be like tomorrow morning. I...

Yeah, and and this is going to be that that was that the first 240 episodes were what? The prologue? I mean, the introduction? The table of contents, really.

Welcome to the welcome to. Now now we're now we're, you know, we start chapter one now, you know, on the next. Everybody take your seats. It's about to start. You know, the real the trailer going right.

Yeah.

I and that's how I'm looking at it too. So I I I think so hopefully the listeners, you folks kind of take it that way too and and get excited about it. And and, you know, it's it's a little bit, you know, we're going to have we're going to have some fun stuff with it. But, um...

Well, any anything else, Greg, you kind of want to add to that? Or or or lessons learned or things we've discussed that we can share with people about the podcast or or what it's become or or any of that? I mean, I don't know if there's anything, it's hard because it's such an emotional time.

Yeah, I will tell you this, there's never been a day or an episode or a guest, a book, anything that we've talked about where Brian and I weren't completely, uh, uh, giving you a 100%. Right? We don't give 90 and we can't give 120, but every time that you see us on here, and that's a promise going forward is we're going to give you the best of and and, uh, you know, are we going to skin our knee here and there? Yeah, but guess what? Uh, it's going to be better and and you're going to see the dramatic changes start day one. So we're excited. But meaning, uh, I'm getting a facelift and Brian's going to shave his head. So we have to keep be interested.

I don't I just and you know exactly can you imagine that what items we'd find under there. Uh, but no, I want to thank everybody because it was it's been a great run and this is going to be exciting times ahead, man.

Yeah, me too. I'm I'm excited for it. Um, and I I I do appreciate everyone who's continued to listen and and reach out with questions. You know, it doesn't bother me when you reach out with questions. I appreciate it and want more. So some a lot of folks are like, "Hey, busy. He's just curious, you know, if you could, you know, no, just reach out and ask, like, hey, man, like, this is what I'm thinking." So because I I need that that constructive feedback. Those questions are what how that's how we get better. And so that that's that's that's, you know, we're always going to do our thing and talk about it, but whether or not it's it's hitting the mark on your end is is the most important part. And and so so I I do appreciate everyone who has and will continue to reach out and please, uh, uh, continue to do so. So I think that's a good good wrap. I'm excited for for the first episode coming up here soon. Uh, just stay tuned everyone. You it's I'm just changing the, uh, the name and and and logos and everything on here. I'm not you're not going to have to subscribe to a new thing or a new episode or, you know, go, I'm not changing any of that just so I can you you'll still get your your episode weekly and and, uh, we'll, uh, we'll go from there. But, um, you know, I thank everyone for for for continuing to listen and for sharing the episode. So we're going to...

Please tell everybody, as usual, that the only way we'll increase reach is with you. So so help us out. And Brian and I are are flying soon. We'll be in Detroit. Our new episode's going to be coming out probably in Detroit, which is kind of a cool thing, right?

Yeah. Yep. That was back to where we started. Yep. Yep. So that that was part of it. You know, that was part of the launch. Um, but, um, yeah, no, and and and the best thing you can do if you don't want to get on the Patreon side and and learn more, you just like listening, we we appreciate it. Share an episode with a friend. That's the biggest way to grow a podcast and get an audience is leaving a little review, hitting the like button, giving us that kind of stuff, and literally just sharing it, sending it to someone else to listen to because that's how the word gets out and that, you know, word-of-mouth way of doing things is so much better because it's not just some, "Oh, everything blows up for a little while and then goes away." It's it's people that's when people really get engaged. So thanks everyone for tuning in. We're looking forward and don't forget that training changes behavior.