Left Of Greg 087 Fake it till you make it is horrible advice.

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Okay, now we're live on Facebook, buddy. All right, Greg, so we will go ahead and get started this morning. First of all, good morning. And happy birthday. Or happy Monday? Happy birthday? I was reading something else from someone, apologize on that. Happy Monday. Somebody's birthday, hopefully. I don't know where I was going with that.

So, today's topic, we're going to jump into a few areas, but it kind of generally falls around the theme of what people say is, "Fake it till you make it," right? Because with any of these things, there's two sides of the coin. In some instances, maybe that's a good thing, or that can work. And sometimes, like we always say in our line of work, this isn't something you can fake. Sorry, you either know what you're doing or you don't.

But what prompted this idea, which I then called you this morning and said, "Hey, let's get on, I got a great idea," is just a funny kind of meme that was going around that I saw. The context behind it is someone sitting in a job interview, right? And the person giving the interview says, "Hey, you know, you're asking for a pretty high salary for someone without any experience." And the person who's being interviewed says, "Well, this job is going to be super hard since I don't know what I'm doing." And I thought that was a perfect way to kind of start off because we heard that a lot. You know, "Fake it till you make it," or "Act like you are that person," or you know, "Model what that is."

And I think in some ways that can be a good thing, right? Especially when dealing with different emotional issues, or I mean, there's different psychological reasons and studies that say, "Hey, that's actually a good thing: the power of positive thinking." But it doesn't apply everywhere, right? It certainly doesn't apply a lot, and especially when you get into subject matter expertise, or opinion-based testimony, or the value of what someone's contributing, right? So maybe I have an opinion on a subject, but this is the first time I'm ever hearing about it. What does that compare to someone who's been studying it their whole life? And I just think that there's a good way to balance it.

So that's kind of where the topic's going to start, Greg. Is that good? Sorry to kind of ambush you after a long time.

I enjoyed exactly last week and am still recovering from that. That's fair to say. And bourbon. Big week in Nashville. And got home late Saturday. Yeah, spent all day Sunday, you know, stringing Christmas lights, trying to figure out where they end, meaning I have no idea where all this voluminous information is going. Yeah, o-dark-thirty call from Marren going, "Eureka!" Which is always fun.

But it's a great topic, Brian, because I like where you're going, based on the fact that you and I recently had a discussion about how today it's almost more acceptable to approach things like an attorney rather than a scientist where you said opinion-based testimony. And, you know what, not a lot of validity to that, unless you're the owl and you're figuring out how many licks it takes to get to the center of that. It's three.

Yeah, exactly.

But, you know, the idea there, Brian, is the standard of subject matter expertise. It's lofty, and it's lofty for a reason, you know? And nowadays, it's almost that, you know, I just briefly—and I'll let you get back to fine-tuning it—you remember that one article, and I think it was USA Today or whatever paper, because we're always in a hotel going somewhere, and it had President Trump's—our current president's—opinion on something, and right next to it, it had Greta Thunberg's opinion. And no offense, I don't care who you love or who you hate or what you think about anybody, but equally valuing those opinions speaks to the heart of how this is problematic. They're not equally weighted. Do you get what I'm trying to say? It takes a long time to get some. And sometimes it's sour grapes where somebody makes a comment, but you can't just say, "Hey, listen, this is all equal." It really isn't.

Right. So, to, to at least frame it a little bit, you know, in some areas of, you know, given that situation of like a new job or a new place that you're in, and sometimes just going, "Yeah, I'm just going to act like I belong here," and maybe because I don't have the confidence, right? Because you're, it's a new job, right? You don't know anyone. Maybe you don't know everything that you're supposed to do, even if you do have experience in that, right? There's still going to be a learning curve. People get nervous about that. So I think in terms of looking at it as a positive thought process to instill confidence so that you can jump in and learn, I like, I'm all for that, right? Hey, act like you belong there. You know it, you know what you're doing.

But that's given that you have the required skills, the required experience, to be at that location at that time. Not just you're thrown into a completely different situation, you never walked in, tried to figure it out. So I like the idea, of course, in terms of, "Hey, fake it until you make it. Act as if you know what you're doing. Act as if you belong there." Those can be very beneficial. And the problem with that is when people do that, and then they go, "Hey, you know what? That worked! I didn't have a clue." You know, they're six months into a job or a year later and they're nailing it, right? They're a stud on the team, they're hitting their numbers, they're going beyond. Everyone's loving it. And then they go, "Hey, look, I'm not going to lie, when I first showed up here, I had no idea what I was doing, but I just acted like I did, and you all accepted me, and then that allowed me to actually learn what was going on." So we now then go, "Hey, it worked!" Right? And there's a million books written about it. There's plenty of motivational quotes and YouTube videos of YouTube professors and gurus and stuff on there telling you, "Hey, that's what you got to do."

And I think that in certain situations, that is a great way to approach things. However, when you're getting, however, however—but let me hold right there, because I think like you just brought up, going into a situation or understanding a new domain or a new topic, something that's heavily nuanced and very complicated, you can't have that same mentality, right? I can't walk into the international meeting of the top neuroscientists in the world and act like I belong there and act like I'm a neuroscientist and have the same...

You're going to be found out.

If not, well, I'm going to be found out. And I don't, I don't rate to do that, right? I don't have the training and education and experience that that person has. So why would I think I come in there? So I just think in the appropriate context, it's okay. Because now you just brought up something that you had mentioned on a previous podcast when looking at information, and I thought it was a great way to sum it up, where he said, "Hey, how are you approaching this? Are you approaching this like a lawyer or like a scientist?" And that's not a knock or that's not a pro or con on either one, right? Each one is used differently. Meaning, if you're taking a scientific approach to it, it's going to be clinical. I have to use artifacts and evidence in support of a reasonable conclusion.

All right. Now, a lawyer's a little bit different. A lawyer still has to understand all of those things, yes, and then go, "All right, how do I spin this?" Right?

But the best... you get them. Yeah. But let me give, let me give you an opinion of that, Brian. So I, and again, here I'm going to resort to opinion-based testimony, but I'm kind of uniquely qualified on this because I watch TV and I like watching a lot of movies. So there's a Clint Eastwood movie, one of the Dirty Harry films, and I don't remember which one. And there's a plane that's getting hijacked. That was really big in the '70s, folks, you have to take a look at that. And the guy, you know, "Take us to Cuba," whatever else. And so Clint Eastwood happens to be at the airport. "Hey, what's the hubbub?" And so he puts on a hat, puts on a jacket, gets out on the plane. He's the pilot that's going to fly them there. And man, he's revving engines, and the engine's going, and everything else. And the guy goes, "Hey, take off! Take off! Why aren't you taking off?" He goes, "Because I have no idea what I'm doing." All he wanted to do is buffalo his way onto the plane, and then he beats up the guys and wins.

Brian, I hope to God that the next time I'm on Delta or United, we don't have Frank Abagnale walking on, sitting down and trying to fake it till he makes it. That's not where I want to be when that lawn dart comes burning in.

Now, the opposite side of that, and let me give you a balancing act here. I do not remember the gentleman's name offhand, but do you remember the guy that killed the people on the subway? Not the... there was a Black male and there was a White male. The White male, he thought that people were going to mug him, so he shot everybody, right? Yeah. But this was a Black male that actually walked down and killed a number of people on the subway at a later time, a different time. Now, think of the name, folks, look it up on the site. But the point being is that he killed a number of people, and now he's in his criminal trial. He fires his defense attorney, says, "I don't need an attorney, I'm going to act as my own." And we all know what that means: when you act as your own, you're going to be an idiot up there, and you're going to get convicted. And beyond that, prosecution loves to see that. I'm guessing he did great. He was a nutcase, and he was a murderer, okay? But very quickly, he started assimilating the lexicon and started sounding like an attorney. And then he started mimicking the attorneys and objecting. You know, and then when the judge said, "You can't just say 'object,' you have to say 'object,' and then say what cause, you know, that, uh, prejudicial," let's say, for example, or whatever. And he started catching on. By the second week in trial, everybody said you would not have known that he didn't go to law school. He was making objections, written objections. He was calling his own witnesses, doing all this other stuff.

So that's what I mean specifically when I say, "the attorney." Because we've all seen—and I haven't inordinately seen an amount of attorneys that weren't worth their juice, that might have a diploma, that got up and literally were just bouncing. You know, they were the spinning top until they found a groove that they were at, and then they repeated their behavior. I think you could say there was a last leg to that stool. How many times have you been in a Denny's late night after a bar? Wait a minute, I'm getting too personal. Sorry. Begging in Denny's after the bar, and you hear somebody talking about their police or military experience? And if you are a subject matter expert, or even purport yourself to be, you can see through that in just moments, right? And bring it full circle, anybody that's got a phone now is a journalist, and these journals, most of them blow, Brian. I'm seeing these articles and the stuff they're downloading, I'm going, "Holy crap, these guys aren't linking two complete thoughts together."

No, no, no. And that's getting... you brought in the example, the guy testifying for himself. And I know, what's his... Ted Bundy didn't, but when he was up there talking to the judge and everyone, you would have thought he was an experienced, exact attorney in a comfortable courtroom. But, you know, that was also because he was a, he's a psychopath, right? Pathological. But what did the attorney, what did the judge say? Do you remember when the judge walked over, the judge gave him the, "Yeah, you know, you would have made a great attorney," and I think that...

Sorry.

Yeah. "Hey, I'm sorry, I got to put you away for the rest of your life."

And I know you made a few minutes. He completely had taken the judge and flipped him around exactly like that. And being the one to uphold the standards of the court was now laughing and joking along with a guy who had killed a lot of people, a lot more than he even had ended up admitting to, I think.

Yeah. And then, you know, he was just a horrible, horrible human being.

One of the... You're talking about a statistically insignificant number of these people exist, but here's one of them, and it's so blatantly obvious and true, and you're treating him like he's a nice gentleman.

But I think that goes into kind of where, where I was going with a lot of this is this, this really is ego-driven. Right, right, right? And so, yeah, you're... there's a fine line. What you said was, everything you said is correct, but there's a fine line between the psychological advantages of self-help, when you're saying, "I can get through this, I can do this," and being an egomaniacal lunatic. You know what I'm saying? That's just that it looks good on a resume.

No, no. Yeah.

And that's what I, that's what I mean, is that, you know, these aren't blanket ideas, blanket concepts, a blanket mindset of how to approach everything. No, that's not. Each one of these things that come out is for a specific time, at a specific place, for a specific purpose, right? Yeah, that type of thinking does work in those specific situations, but you can't then apply that everywhere and go, "Well, now I'm a geologist, and that rock formation isn't rocks, it's a tree that was cut down by giants that used to exist a thousand years ago." And you can...

You've been watching the Learning Channel.

Yeah, I've been... I had a recent discovery Facebook post that someone sent me, and I punched myself in the face for ten minutes, and then, and then laughed. But no, no, but but that, that's what it gets into. So, and I, the reason why I brought up ego, and if those listening, it's just, it's a term where we're all humans. All of us are very egocentric people, right? It doesn't necessarily, it's not a negative. I'm not approaching it from negative like, "Oh, look at the ego on you." Look, we all have, we all get offended and sad when we shouldn't, and this and that. Like we all, it's a survival mechanism. It's clearly on board for our survival from some, more more than others. But that's kind of what it gets into. And that goes into the attorney versus scientist and how you become kind of a subject matter expert at something, at anything, right? Because we all want to believe, especially you brought up the military and law enforcement thing. Well, once I get taught something, once I get a little bit of training, and like I'm so excited, you know, I learned a new skill set, and I want to go tell everyone about it, and, "Oh, look, this is really difficult and blah, blah, blah. Like I can do this and I can do that." It was like I heard a drunk Marine, the guy that he could kill people from 500 yards away because you just finished an iron sight's rifle class. And you're like, "Well, that's that's him apart." Okay, buddy, look, right? Good job, good job, you shot expert. Awesome. But meeting, we equate that. And I think a lot of that comes into ego as well. And that "fake it till you make it" can kind of feed that, right? It can kind of feed the beast a little bit to now if I do start, if I start faking it and I continue to make it, then I'm going to keep faking it, and I'm going to keep making it, and that's going to keep going, right, until some point now I'm the subject matter expert, right? Yes. I think that's my, my, my big problem with a lot of these these sayings or these ways to look at it is, is look, it's, it's for a specific time, at a specific place. And I know we get into that a lot with anything that we do where we say, "Hey, you know, this means this at this exact time." Right? And then someone tries to take that and go, "Oh, well, over here that would be the same thing." Right? And you got to go, "No, that's a completely different situation." So what does that take? Like because I know I brought up the term, we all give opinion-based testimony in our own life and our own social media posts. Yes. So I get to look at something and go, "Well, I'm entitled to my own opinion." It's like, "Yes, that's right. We have those rights guaranteed to us and you can actually express it openly too because we have an amazing Bill of Rights in this country, and we get to do that." So how do I use that? How do I stop myself, Greg?

No, no, don't stop yourself. I think I think have a voyage of discovery. So a voyage of discovery, we're going to go on a little voyage of discovery like that. Take the phone book and just randomly pick... is there phone books anymore? I'm so old. Take your rotary dial, you know, put a nickel in the machine, and just shut up, you bastards. So what I'm saying is call the operator, right? You just said, "Connect me with 294. Yeah, Prescott 294." No. So what you just said is very, very enlightening to me. So you have your opinion and you're entitled to it. So I have my opinion, and John has his opinion, and Bill has his opinion. Sharon and Shelly, they both had their opinion. We're all sitting in the same room, and we just met through the phone book gig. You know, all these people walking down a gosh-darn aisle in a store, do they have malls anymore? In a mall, and a guy says, "Hey, for five bucks, we want to ask you a couple of questions. Everybody come in here." So all the people go in and they sit in their seats, and they said, "Okay, everybody here has an opinion, and they're equally weighted." Well, that's where the train just went off the tracks and crashed and burned, Brian. Just because you have an opinion doesn't mean your opinion's right. And just because there's two or five people in the room doesn't mean two or three or five of them have equal opinions. What happens is something like age, where you grew up, the experiences that you had, whether you're married, whether you had kids, whether you had a divorce, or what, had nine divorces, no, no pun intended, whether you're a hopeless alcoholic that beats your wife... Oh my gosh, I got to get off of Brian today. And whatever it is, come home, kick the dog. But the idea is that, follow me here: you are a unique little snowflake, but that doesn't mean you're, thank you, everybody else. And in the Constitution and laws and everything says, "We're all created equal." Yes, we're all created equally. But when it comes to testifying, or when it comes to giving your opinion, or when it comes to being a scientist, you don't want to be one slide deep. And you don't want to be the second-grade trainer in the third grade, because in those instances, everything's magic, Brian. When you learned everything that's on like a PowerPoint slide, and you're up there and you're talking about, that's great until the guy that wrote that slide comes up and goes, "Okay, so what's the tensile strength of, you know, titanium?" Or whatever. Now you don't know that. So don't fight out of your league. If you are a unique little snowflake, understand what it is that you know, and then ask questions about it and be often say, be humble enough to say, "You know, I really don't know that."

Now, you, you've been with me a long time. I've been with you. You understand that I'm the biggest egotist in the world. But if I'm in a group and I hear a comment, I hear a word, or somebody says something, I'll raise my hand and say, "I don't understand. What does that mean? Can you explain it? What does that mean in this context?" You know why? Because I want to learn rather than huff and sit back and disagree with something because I'm uncomfortable with the fact that I don't have knowledge on that topic. They're subject matter experts for a reason. The reason that word is in the dictionary is because there's certain people that are better. I, I love skating and I played hockey a third of my life. I don't fancy that I can go out and still do it, and I don't think I could go out for the Nordiques. You get what I'm saying? So balance that, that fragile ego system with the reality of the situation. And it's not taken away from you. I can't fly, Brian, I'd like to imagine that I could.

Yeah. No, it took me... Yeah, no, I did the same thing with trying to dunk a basketball. All the way...

There you go.

I was like, probably 30, early 30s, I was doing a lot of plyometric stuff at the time. So I got to the point where I could touch the rim. I'm 5'10".

I don't even know what plyometric is, but that was really cool because some of our people are writing that down and saying, "Next time somebody asked them, they're plyometric."

Yeah. So I could touch the rim. And then immediately thought like, "Oh, man, it must not be like, I've got what? Another six months of keep doing at this where I can dunk a basketball." Well, first of all, I can't even palm a basketball. Second of all, you have to get your hands so much higher. And I was like, "Wow, this is okay. This is never going to happen. This is something I could ride."

Are you looking in your driveway, you know, playing with one of those adjustable? That's cool.

No, with the same thing, it was like, "All right, I had to learn like, 'Oh, this is, this is, this is going to... I'm biologically, I was not meant to do this, right? This is just not going to, not going to happen in my wheelhouse.'" I always like using that one. But on, on one of the, I kind of want to get this more, we just talked about at the beginning, but we've came up on, on a previous podcast when you kind of said, you know, the attorney versus the scientist. And I, I like that analogy because, like anything, you can take it in a few different ways, right? What you mean by that, but I'd love for you to kind of elaborate on what specifically you mean when you say, you know, "attorney versus scientist," because it's both a, a one, it's a you have a level of training and education behind it, right? And but you're, it's, it's two different sort of ways of thinking, right?

Yep. So, you have sometimes, and this is so police work and lawyer-oriented and judicial system, I hate to do that, so I'll try to contrive something outside of that while I'm talking. There are legal standards, Brian. And the more that you work the road, the better you understand the comparisons. So I'll tell you right now, I would challenge the coppers that are in the audience. There's, there's still police chiefs, there's still attorneys, there's still judges that believe probable cause and reasonable suspicion are the same thing.

Yeah.

And they're completely different standards. And they have a list of, they're very similar. And to the person on the street, if I described them right now, they'd go, "That sounds like the same thing." But as a legal standard, Brian, they're completely different. And, and so you say a term like "under color of law" when an agency or person is acting with the auspices that they've been sworn into a position, whether they're in uniform or not. The things they say matter differently to that community and to that officer, right? So then somebody is going to say, "Well, you know, you can't do that or you can't say that." Well, actually, by the position I'm in right now, I can do that, right? And like for, for example, a police officer has more power than like the Senate and the judiciary branch and everybody else, because they can determine life or death and end the due process clause by shooting you, right? Or escalating a level of force to where you die. So what happens is, we think, the average human being thinks that everything's okay, I'm here, I've got my ticket, I get entry. And life isn't really like that. Life is a wonderful life, liberty, pursuit of happiness. I get that. But why would we go to school if somebody didn't know more? And why is there a difference between a teacher and a tenured professor? Because as life comes at you, there's certain amounts of information that that you may know better than somebody else.

And you brought up a great one that I, that I didn't even consider: human performance. So, while I understand running, what I'm trying to say clearly, my arms move faster than yours, Brian, but I don't go any faster. I'm not going to fancy myself as a runner, but we, we just have to put things in perspective that when it comes to like, like science, science, and oxygen and hydrogen and molecules. There's something I can point at that go together, and they always go together the same way. And if there's anomalies, there's a special rule that goes along with that. Life, not so much. People grow up and they think that they have the same stake in life and the same opportunities as everybody else. And when they find out they don't, instead of trying to fix it the proper way, then we sometimes get angered. Hey, Sean Clements just sent me that article about a guy that drove all the way from what it was, I think it was Michigan to Texas to kill the guy because he was angry and drove all the way back. We get stuff like that when we don't understand stuff, Brian, it's easy to get angry first. It's easy to get disappointed or, or turn your back on the rest of society and say, "Oh, you bastards dropped me," you know, "because I wasn't the same."

No, no. And so that kind of goes back to the, the lawyer versus the scientist, right? So, you know, if I'm approaching something because a lot of people, and this is what some people have asked me, you know, we get it asked when we're in person, I get emails, it's like, "Well, how do I, how do I conceptualize what you're talking about?" Meaning, "Yeah, how do I actually use it when I'm reading an article or watching a movie or listening to a story just in real time to sit there and go, 'Wait a minute here, how am I supposed to filter or decipher this information?'" Because I've seen some stuff where I'm like, "Wow, that looks, the way they presented this looks so believable." But, you know, "No, the Earth isn't flat, so I know it's complete hogwash." I get it. But you get what I'm saying? It's like, how do I compete against that at a personal level? Like, go ahead.

So there's a, there's a caper, and I won't get into the weeds on the caper, but if you, if you look it up, you'll get a lot smarter. And, and learning is the key to so much. But a copper sees a car pull into a 7-Eleven, let's call it, and he sees the guy bounce out and run inside. Guy's only there for a couple of minutes. Guy comes around and outside, peels off, and car goes to another convenience store. Sees it pull up, hastily leaves the door open, the guy runs inside. So the copper says, "This is frippery, man, I got a crime in progress. This guy just robbed the last two places." So confirmation bias takes over. The police officer stops a guy. The guy goes, "Look, I'm a diabetic, and if I don't get a glass of orange juice in a few minutes, I'm going to go into shock, and I'm going to die." The copper says, "Hold your mouth, let me see some ID." And now a fight incurs. Another copper comes up, and he goes, "What's the matter? The guy's fighting with me. He won't give it to me." And now it escalates, and they got the guy in the three-point restraint and everything else. Listen, anybody that's on the cop side says, "You don't know." Well, I do know, so shut up and sit down for a minute. The idea is, confirmation bias made me see what I wanted to see, and I didn't take the perspective because he's the offender and I'm the cop, and I got the badge. Now, I'm not bashing on cops, so I'll give you the flip side of that, Brian, that turned into horrible case law, and now there's a whole bunch of rules you got to follow because the guy never considered an alternative.

So yesterday, Shel and I—and it's gosh-darn so hot in the wind, we got the smokes from all the fires that you guys are starting. I should sue you bastards.

Yeah, we're taking water from you from the Colorado River.

Exactly. Our smoke from our fires. Hopefully, hopefully nobody's injured, because it's a terrible situation. But so we're watching this show, and this this older guy and this young kid, it was a really bizarre relationship, and if I lived in that community, I'd be looking into that. And they're going to an abandoned church. And it's not a church if it's abandoned, it's an abandoned building, you know what I'm talking about? And they're searching around, and they're looking for evil. Okay, well, go... Okay, if you're looking, if you're evil, I know how to do that. So they get to a broken mirror, and the announcer—and it's not Leonard Nimoy for a change—the announcer goes, "We all know that mirrors are portals from the underworld."

Brian, I never knew that. I didn't know that either. I didn't know that either.

So I went, I threw all my mirrors out towards you before you go any farther, hand. But there's a perfect example of, of, "Hey, we all know." So now I'm watching, but but now if I'm watching, I don't know, I go, "Oh, crap, I'm supposed to know that."

Yeah, right, right.

So now you're faking it until you make it. So the next guy comes up, like you urinate, and then, you know, they got the mirror in the men's bathroom. You go, "You know that's a portal to hell," whatever. So, so I'll try that.

Okay, yeah, try that next time.

And go, "How about these?" You'll get the same response. So the guy's taking a picture, a movie picture, not that like I'm not, you know, that old archaeo, but he's taking a picture into the mirror and he goes, "Holy crap, look, there's a face in the mirror!" And I'm crying, I'm laughing so hard because what happens is parallax, and the distance from the mirror, and right, it's shining on is creating two images, and it's his image, you know, inset on the other image. So the other guy walks up and it's like, "Holy crap, there's another one!" And, and so they're calling this out like, "Oh my God, this is what's good, Brian, you see what you want to see in those situations." Now what happened, our adrenal cortex is pumping, it's a little bit scary, it was a little bit hot, you have more than one people. A situation takes it on. Now a scientist is going to slow that down and he's going to say, "Hold on, these are the things that happen." A lawyer's going to go, "Yes, but Sergeant Williams, isn't it possible that there was a demon in that mirror?" "No, it wasn't." "So you're saying it's not possible because you're a Christian, but if you were a Satanist," "Are you asking me to speculate?" You get what I'm trying to say? He's got to put a spin on it, and he don't care how outlandish it is. Well, one of those juries goes, "I could see that. His guy's off, Brian." So that's about it.

That's, yeah, that's creating that explanatory storyline and creating doubt, right? Because that goes to the, I love the argument, "Well, you can't prove that it wasn't a ghost!" It's like, what? That's, uh, there's actually a scientific answer.

Now, Brian, where it says, "Of all the UFOs, if scientifically, if we do an algorithm, if they're unexplained and one of them can't be explained, that therefore that proves a theory." No, it doesn't. It doesn't prove anything. What it is is you saw something you can't explain. But let's tie that back into human performance or human behavior. Yeah. Who, let me depose you for a second, who's the worst witness in the world? An eyewitness. Why is an eyewitness the worst witness? Because all of our strengths and fears and trepidations, Brian, come in and start changing the picture. And we already know that reality and fantasy are the same to the human brain. So I can be testifying legally and, and, and ethically saying, "Yes, this is what I think is going on," but my brain has shown me a bill of goods, Brian, that just isn't true. So we have to be careful not to to, you know, run blindly into and accept a conclusion that's not bound in science.

Yeah. And that, that can be, that can be, uh, that I feel like that gets more and more difficult to do on an everyday level because of how well-produced information is now, right?

Oh, you're exactly right. Because we're, we're now kind of conditioned to that.

You can see that stuff with movies and documentary stuff or whatever. Like, when you put something together really, I mean, that's what it is, it's building a case, right? And saying...

Exactly right.

Any documentary is meant to portray what the person making it wanted to portray, right? So it's not, it's not going to show you, it generally doesn't show you the other side of it. It's like your, your favorite one, the, the, uh, Making a Murderer, the guy from Wisconsin.

Uh, Lord. I think, yeah, I don't know, I think that they did, two. Well, Brandon, maybe he's still in jail, so I don't think he really lied. (Referring to Steven Avery and Brendan Dassey)

So, so it's, I mean, that's, that's one of the, that's one of the things that, you know, we often forget when it is produced really well. And when, when you, when you put out those morsels of information, what seems like a logical manner, like it leads to that confirmation bias very easily. So you just have to remember when you're watching, because you're being led, what, what does your brain, right? What does your brain want more than anything else? Your brain wants to make order out of chaos. Not you, but your brain wants to make order out of chaos, right? So the Sudoku or the crossword or any of those other stuff appealed to us. Though it works saying that Rubik's Cube, those kind of things are fun to us. The two horseshoes, you know, you go to the, the dude ranch and they're like, and then a guy takes them apart and say, "Ben and Teller." The idea, the reason because of that, is because our brain has to make order out of chaos. And we, because we're egotistical, think that we, we're in on it. Yeah. And, and, and we think that we saw something, we understand it, so we come up with the storyline. And then all of a sudden somebody comes up and goes, "Yeah, but that's not exactly right." A scientist will say, "Well, it was swamp gas, and that these swamp gases, the pond actually turns upside down, and now all those things are released, and that's why you saw this big glowy thing." And you go, "Wow, never thought of that." Yeah, you never thought of it. Now the local says, "I saw it in my headlights! I know what I said. Amphibious, just, I know what I saw! And it's Collier!" (referring to a cryptid hunter or similar character) Right? And he's willing to go to bat for the furry skunk ape that stole his baby. Yeah. So you can't fight that, that's a different case because the perception is a reality.

Well, not just, I think he's shaped it. I think he's looking for his father. But, um, he's looking for his long-lost family in the woods.

No, but that, that's, that's, that's a, it's a good explanation of how these, how and why these things occur, right? Meaning, how do I get led down this path of, you know, then finding out and this is with because you're not being a jerk, you're not, you know, even when Loch Ness, even when the guy that created the Loch Ness Monster in the video on his deathbed said, "It was all a hoax," just like Bigfoot, "It's all a hoax." What do people say? "Well, that's when they come in, they, that's what they want you to believe, Greg, the infamous they."

Hey, so...

So, no, no. But, but you brought it up right there. In that comment, was that it's not that sometimes we, we don't mean to, we don't want to. Like, my friend, you tell me a compelling story, Greg, and I go, "Damn, that's messed up!" Or, "Holy crap, I didn't believe that." Then I tell two friends, and they tell two friends, and they tell, "Oh my God, that's hilarious and racist but hilarious."

Yeah. Well, but that's what I'm saying is like, it, it grows and grows and grows and I go, "Holy cow, like I, I didn't, I didn't know about that." That this is a very, an emotional topic. So what stories do that? Stories that are, well, that are low on facts and titillating and scintillating, right? And might have a little bit of an emotional comment.

Yeah, yeah, you're exactly right. So you have those and, Brian, I'll tell you right now, when we start talking science, people tune out.

Yeah. But if we started talking about the other beard, you know, and how you groom that, if you know what I'm saying, the manscaper, people will tune back in right around where you live. Right?

No, I, I think, I think we... well, that comes into, you know, with the sensationalizing of the information always makes it more titillating and exciting. I don't know if I can say it, but you can't do that. Do you remember The Simpsons episode? We lived, folks, on Family Guy and The Simpsons.

Yeah, well, it wasn't reality.

Yeah. Lisa fell in love with her teacher. And I think he was portrayed by like Dustin Hoffman. It was a really great thing. And, you know, he was playing Henry David Thoreau and Juan and then the other, he was Lincoln, and then he was Mary Shelley. And you, you, Brian, would love to think that your daughter's teachers are that elastic, that they have all of those, and they'll ask for Yorick, "I knew him, Horatio," that they can handle a crowd. And, Brian, we've been through some Tier One operators are the best. And I wouldn't want to be at the end of their muzzle, right? But they couldn't teach their way out of the room. So don't purport that they're equal. Some people are very smart and can't teach it. Some people, you know, are great actors, but when it comes to it, they're only a slide deep. That's America. That's the world. That's humans. And it's okay to be that way. That's what makes us different and exciting.

Yeah, no. And, and this kind of, that, that adds to another, of someone can be an expert or well-informed or really good in one area, and then they're going to voice their opinion another, and it doesn't deserve their lane, right?

So hold on, let me give you an example of that, and then you give one. So a good friend that we know that's short and angry and looks like Hồ Chí Minh, do you get what I'm saying, in real time? Okay. And he does, folks, this is not cultural appropriation, okay? So there was an elk hung up in a fence, and the elk couldn't get out of the fence, and the elk had to be killed. Okay. So this person drove up and comes running in the house and says, "Do you have," and he was very specific about the weapon and the caliber and and even the action that he wanted to go down and kill the elk. And I said, "No, but I got this." "Nah, that's not going to do it." I go, "It'll do it. I, you know, no stranger to murder, death, kill, this is going to do fine because it's all about shot placement. I could take a knife down and we could do it that way. This will be much more clinical." Now, "Effort, I'm out of here!" Got into an argument. We didn't talk for weeks. We didn't talk for like five weeks. So the elk finally died. Do you get what I'm trying to say? Yeah. And thank God I didn't have to watch it. But the idea was this guy reloads, he's a genius. He grew up with Fred Bear, knows everything about internal, external, terminal ballistics, and every weapon. Brian, if you asked for foot-pounds per second, he'd be, "Yeah, yeah." But when I challenged him with, "This will do just as good, Brian, I could have taken a frying pan down." Do you understand what I'm trying to say? The elk was in trouble, and I wanted to do it. But guess what? He was led to believe that his little bocce ball of knowledge was much more important than importing knowledge or comparing knowledge with somebody else. That's being a dick. That's being just as bad as appropriating knowledge that you don't have, you know, and mimicking it. So, you know, "doing it until you," you know, what did you call, "faking it until you make it"? I think I think those were equally weighted. So now...

No, no, no, that's, that's a good, that's actually... reminded me. Well, actually, um, we're since we're face streaming live, and of course my buddy Dan Heylick, he just hopped on too. But it reminded me of my other buddy Mark, who, you know, this is only a few, few years ago, let's say five years ago, whatever. He was worked out of the gym, he's a, you know, in his sixties now, he's a retired SEAL, but he's like a stud runner. I think he still holds the one-mile record down at Coronado, you know, for the same one-mile sand run. You know, I mean, like he's just, his record's held, he's a total stud. But him and his wife do that. That's their thing. They, they teach running clinics and they do. I mean, they're just fitness, they're just, they're total badasses, right? And, you know, it's hilarious because he did say to me one time after we did some workout together, there was running in it, and I could barely keep up with it. I'm like, "Dude, what, what the hell?" This guy's crushing it. And at the time I was still in really, really decent running shape. I mean, I didn't run very often but could still, you know, run, you know, a six-minute mile or do whatever, you know. And, and he just looked at me, he's like, "Well, well, Brian, who, who taught you how to run?" And I was like, "What do you, what do you mean?" And he's like, "Who taught you how to run?" And I was like, "It's, it's running. Like, you just go, you just go run. Yeah, like I'm a human being." And he's just like, "Okay, why don't you come on by on Saturday?" And I learned more in one day. Completely changed the way. Because, but that, that, I was just that hit me so hard because it was like, "But you're right, it's a skill."

But it's further, Brian. Point is, it's a human performance, but human performance is one that you can't fake.

Yeah, yeah. But it's, it's, that's what I'm saying, it's a skill. Running is exactly right. So, so if you weren't taught that skill, it's like I've, you know, I've built a table before. No one really taught me how to do that. We have YouTube videos and I learned how to do stuff and learn. So if someone had shown me, would it have been a lot easier and much better?

I saw Brian's shitty table. Well, that's what, that's what people call it when I'm not in the room. I don't know. So look, look what you're talking about is you're talking about human performance. So human performance including being a carpenter or a runner or anything else. Okay, those are the skills that if you fake, you'll die. And I'll give you a question, okay? So how many people had gone to take a selfie and fallen off? That happens all the time from something. Yeah. And you're saying, "Oh, it's this, it's that, it's the other." It's you are promoting your performance to a level where you don't maintain or attain it, and so you don't have it. And so you're up there doing that, and you never consider the danger. Why? Because your ego tells you, "How you got this?" It's a phone. You're thinking about the phone in the picture, and you're so excited about the picture that you're never considering, "Hey, listen, I can't hold on that long. You know, there's a thing called gravity." Again, we're back to the science. But the attorney in you would say, "But you have every right to go up there, step across that line that warns you not to do it." I'm telling you, Brian, you're onto something because we make mistakes when we exceed our, our human potential. And human potential can be psychological or it can be physical. And in any time that you purport to be something that you're not, you risk that.

Now, there's a few people that have written books about it. And like you said, yeah, some blog geniuses that got into a certain thing. There's that lady that gets caught all the time in L.A., and I don't remember her name, where she always tries to go in with the stars, and she, you know, it is, you know, invited. Oh, yeah, yeah, they tackle her all the time, and everybody's got her photo. She just wants the attention, Brian. She's an attention hound, right? But she's willing, and sometimes she does get in. So what are the catecholamines in her brain? What do the electrochemical neurotransmitters tell her if she's right? Okay, we're in a mall. You remember you're in the mall, and the guy goes, "Hey, taste this." And we go, "Hey, you don't even work here." And he goes, "Yeah, but that guy over there is doing the Coke taste test." So we go over to that guy, and now he says, "Taste this," and we taste it too, and you were right three times in a row. What does that do to your brain? All of a sudden, Brian gets a new business card that says, "I'm the official Coke taster." By the way, folks, we saw the Oscar Mayer Wienermobile on the freeway outside of Nashville. But do you get what I'm trying to say? It's easy to equate that we're a genius or an expert, and we'll drop the mic the first time we hit the bullseye. Brian, that doesn't make us an expert.

No, I, I, it doesn't. And, and I think that's, that's more of a, um, an interpersonal way of looking at it, right? So going like, "All right, like you said, you know, don't fight out of your league." You know, we've heard that. Exactly. We've heard that before.

The weight class for a reason, buddy. That, that opens up a whole 'nother conversation.

But we're talking about my weight? No, wasn't, I wasn't even actually referring to that. But when you get into weight class and divisions, that's also why we have a, like a, like a men's and women's division in sports.

Um... no, no. But listen, that's a whole 'nother...

No, no. I mean, but, but that, that's, that's what I'm saying is that, you know, don't fight out of your league. So that's an interpersonal way I can look at it, right? I can look in the mirror. I can understand, "All right, wait, where do I really fall in here?" But that takes a little bit of self-awareness, and I have to actually evaluate. But I mean, even just because I like to apply this too, that's everything we just talked about, everything you brought up about, about ego and the, the voyage of discovery, which I like. That's actually the subtitle for my life. It would be "Brian Marren: Voyage of Discovery, haven't found anything yet, Greg."

And the worst part is that it's sponsored by a pharmaceutical company. Think about that, folks. Think about that. It's waiting on a real important blood vessel, important test. But no, but but it, and part of it is, is looking at that when we, when we're taking in information. I'll give you a perfect example of me because I, I was talking to you about it right before we started recording, that Netflix did this. Well, it wasn't Netflix, it was someone else before that. It's finally on there now. I can watch on Netflix because I have the subscription, I didn't, didn't pay for it before. So it was the, um, the speaking, it's called "self-reporting fun." Ten-part series on, on the Chicago Bulls during the nine years I grew up in Chicago, right? All this stuff. And they, it's funny because like, you know, I mean, it's, it's emotional. Like I'm tearing up during it just remembering as a kid how exciting it was. And when Michael Jordan's father died and everything happened, like you felt like you were part of that because they were our team, right? Growing up, it was, it was the biggest thing ever. We used to go downtown, Grant Park, to the rallies in the summer. But, but then they talk a little bit, you know, they, they get into a little bit about Michael Jordan's gambling and this. And I'm like, "Oh, yeah, I see that." And then halfway through that episode, I'm going like, "Wait a minute, this guy was a horrible gambling addict." Like, there was a lot going on. Now, I'm not buying any kind of conspiracy thing about his dad dying, but what I'm saying is I'm watching this going, "Yeah," because they're interviewing Michael Jordan and he's tearing up, it's this emotional thing. I'm going, "Yeah, you're right, no, yeah, that doesn't matter. That's not a big deal that this happened, and then this happened, and then this happened, and then this situation, and then that situation, and this much money was known, and this much money." And you're going like, "Dude, wait a minute, you have a problem. Like, you have a, you may be able to afford it because you're making a lot of money, but you have, that's a difference too. You have, you do have a problem." And I, but it's so funny, just even me knowing that and understanding, is looking at it, you get caught up in that going, "Oh, yeah, I can really see that side." But no one during this documentary balanced it out with like, "Hey, here was this shady character that the feds found a check with Michael Jordan's name on it for him, which he lied about what it was for." Like, that's showing us, that showing intent, right? And that's a serious problem. Now that goes into, you know, dealing with that, that's, I get it, it's very different. He's rich and can afford that stuff. But, but you're kind of glossing over the fact that this is a serious issue that affected him, affected his family, affected his performance, and affected the team. So meaning, as we're, we're watching those documentaries or reading that information or writing that article, you know, having that reaction, you have to personally balance that out with, right? And go, "What, what's, what would the other side say? What's the other side of that coin?"

But there's, there's even more there, Brian. What you just did is fully illustrated the lawyer against the scientist again. So you were approaching it from a science standpoint: "This is interesting, this needs to be followed up. These are anomalies. Generally, those anomalies lead to this type of frippery, this type of illegality, you know, and to deaths, and to, you know, enforcement actions and stuff." But on the other side, you just alienated everybody that's a basketball fan. Do you get what I'm trying to say? And they're saying, "Hey, none of that matters." And we've met those guys, Brian, you and I have met those guys that sports is more important than this, and you don't understand anything. And now they're going to be vociferous and maybe even violent because they want to back up their thing, and you just chose those facts out of all the facts. No, life is so full of facts that we can cherry-pick just those facts that, that improve our argument. And that's where we started this with confirmation bias. If you're so involved in confirmation bias, like, like for example, now in the news—and I, I won't go there because we'd open up to a whole bunch of other hours, but we should give ourselves an hour to, to that. You see something on the news and it turns your stomach because there's information, and you look at it, you go, "Why? How could something like that happen?" The way something like that happens is people gloss over the facts and only choose the facts that fight their argument. That's why Democrats and Republicans are so far apart right now. That's why the news can't follow a story to the, the fruition. And that's why when I read an article on the plane, just, just a day ago, I've got to read about it. And no matter what the article is, the beginning, the preamble, let's call it, the, the center of the article has a few facts, and then the end of it gives me all the incidents of violence that happened in the last six months, as if they're, you know, they're conflating them, but as if those are balancing acts. I need to know, how about the old days when we were going to, you know, "I'll give you the facts, you decide what that means." And where an editorial, Brian, was a very rare thing. And who did it? It was the president of that, you know, the president of CBS, and he would say, "Folks, I'm kind of worried about that." Now everybody has an opinion, right back to where we were at the beginning. And because they have social media, Brian, they think they're equal to everybody else's opinion.

Well, yeah. And I, I, the, the reporting of it is, is an editorializing of things can, can, um, can start to happen. And what happened is then people would get backlash for their editorials when they shouldn't, because it's an editorial, they're giving, "Hey, this is my opinion." I'm not, I'm not reporting, "Hey, this is what occurred at 11:57 a.m., so-and-so walked in." Like, no, I'm saying, "This is what I think of the situation." So that's okay, is right? If you're, if you're stating that up front, I, I get it. But that goes into like you said, everyone's a, everyone's a journalist now. But I, I, I, I think that this...

So, Joe, always finish that argument: just don't rest your argument to me based on opinion testimony and something that you read where somebody said it, because that's called hearsay. If you have personal knowledge, tell me at the beginning of the conversation, "I saw this." Now, if you're saying, "I heard this," or "I saw a video that somebody else produced," it's immediately suspect. And I'm not saying you have to live your life in a, in a cone of silence. Do you get what I'm saying?

I'm saying the last case of emotions. Yeah, exactly.

I'm saying go outside your door and find things out for yourselves. And that's what college is supposed to be about. That's what high school is supposed to be about. That's what Tinder and Grindr are supposed to be about: you go out there and experience for yourself what's your life. I'm, I'm just going to come walking in your hotel room blindfolded, feeling my way around, whatever happens, happens. No, no. But you get what I'm saying, because then, well, you're, you know what's right for you. It's wrong to put your values on your kid, but your kid has to have order until that.

Right. I, I, I agree about, you know, you see with parents with their kids dressed up in political garb, regardless of what side, it don't know what I'm trying to do is exactly finds a cheeseburger. Yeah. What I'm trying to say, you deciding, I don't know, you have to... that, that's, I'm, I'm very much against that. I've seen a lot of groups that do that. Um... yeah, they're not the, uh, they're not good. They're not good.

We were at the airport. I, I was taking a picture of the guy with the weed hat, the 75-year-old guy that I sent. Yeah, weed hat. And then I was doing the balancing act. I had to watch him a little longer, so I sat down to see if he really knew what that logo was because it said on Denver on the back. And I wanted to make sure he knew that that wasn't like a team. But as I listened for a minute, I figured out, "Yeah, he knew it." So his wife was walking around, you know how we play the old people game, "Hey, what, what did he say?" So the guy from the back of that, they were like a "Cape Bueno" or something, like, "no habla," the, the name of the place. But the woman out there said, "Hey, was that bacon or avocado or something?" And she said, "Avocado." She said, "No animals!" And she yelled it really loud. And she's wearing her, you know, Birkenstocks. And she was just the epitome of what you would expect. And you wonder, "How do people fall into that trap, Brian?" We start believing something. Yes. Start following a movement, right? Address changes, our words change, and then we immerse ourselves. It's not unlike religion, and I don't mean that negatively. It's just us belonging to a group with a single purpose, and this is what we believe. And if I, the problem is, I, you can't interpret everything for those lenses. You have to be able to get comfortable being uncomfortable.

But I, I do need to bring this up because this is, no, this is part of the reason why I came to you with this. I completely forgot about the story. I didn't get pictures of this at the airport because they sat right next to me and all around me. But we're sitting, I'm sitting at the airport in Nashville, right, flying back on Saturday. And, um, I had to, uh, my connecting, I was on Delta, was through Minneapolis, right? So I was going to Minneapolis and then back to San Diego. So there's this group in there and their family in some way. I don't think it was the dad. I think it might have been an uncle because they were using his first name, but it doesn't matter. So, uh, youngest in the group were like 20s, like maybe mid-20s. Then there was like someone in their 40s. And this, I was in there 50 or 60, kind of that range, right? So they, I saw them checking in and I was like, immediately called up. So I couldn't get photos of them right away either because I was pissed. And then I was like, "You got to be kidding me, they're on my flight." So I'm sitting there. But I couldn't, every time I brought my phone out to take a picture, the one guy was staring at me. So I'm like, "Don't want to start an altercation here, this would be great."

But here's why, what caught my attention: they were talking about hunting and they were talking about different like shotgun loads and this, that and the other, right? So I started looking at them. They all had these camo backpacks. And I don't remember the brand, I don't know too much, but it was a very nice bag. I'm looking at that bag, I'm like, "That's like a two, three hundred dollar bag, easily, easily a three hundred dollar bag with that camouflage pattern." I know that's really high-end, that's good stuff, right? So they all had that on. They had on this hat from some brand too, same thing. Like, you know, "Okay, they got that going." Then they all, I started looking at everything that they're wearing, Greg. The thing is about those bags and about their boots and about their pants and about those hats, they looked like they just stepped out of a sporting goods store. Meaning, not one thing on them had said they had ever been, I don't know, hunting. Right? I've never hunted an animal before in my life, right? But I could look at them, I know enough for just from my friends who hunt and talk about it and list stuff I've listened to and tried to learn. They're like, "Wait a minute, this seems off!" Because not one, Greg, there wasn't a single scuff mark on their boots, right? A hat that the older man was wearing was perfectly creased, brand new. Still had the sticker underneath the brush, sun damage, right? Nothing. And I don't know all of their stuff and I'm going like, "Dude, you spend more on clothes at what, just with what you're wearing that I've spent on clothes in the last like two years!" You know what I'm saying? And they were talking about what they were doing and, and the one guy in the room, "No, you got to get up early, you're going to be up by 7 a.m." And I'm like, "Wait, first of all, 7 a.m. or early? We're already done." Yeah, we're trying. I'm done. Worked out. I'm dressed and a lot of getting drunk. I'm still like two, three, you know what I don't know. But here's the thing, I was just looking at it and I'm going like, "What? That's it! They're acting as if they're doing the, they're doing the as if they 'fake it till you make it' like with all that stuff." But anyone, like wherever they were going, this hunting, if you show, if they showed up looking like that, anyone there would be like, "Uh, hey, is this your first time?" You get what I'm saying? So I'm curious, is that kind of what sparked part of this? But yeah, but just looking at that, we, but that's just normal, right? If I'm doing that, I project an image.

Exactly. Yeah. We project an image to the world of how we want to be treated. We teach people how to treat us. The problem is that we don't sometimes ask other people, "What do you think I'm projecting here?" You see, because if, if you're convinced with your top knot and your douchebaggery that you're projecting this image and that you're somebody else, and you know, the, the people that are looking at you and watching you are saying, "Panther Sweat from Odeon," you know, they, they're right, "60 percent of the time, it works every time." My point exactly. So I have made the mistake, and you'll find this, I, I have made the mistake because I can't hear, of inventing what it was that I think I heard, and then going on and carrying on a conversation. And then my good friend would come up to me, and my good friend would say, "That's not what he asked you," or, "That's not what they said." And then I'm embarrassed, but I have to go back to ground zero and start again. All I'm telling you, Brian, give it time and distance. Slow it down. Measure things in context. Yeah. And when you think that you're projecting with your words, your statements, your actions, one thing, take a poll, see exactly how that's coming across. Because if you're coming across by pushing me or threatening me, or, you know, saying my opinion doesn't matter, then you're going to hurt me. And when my ego system is challenged, trust me, I'm going to fight back. That's psychological de-escalation 101. I have a very fragile ego system. I think that I'm right, and anytime that you come up that it's like, if your friend says, "No, that's not it at all," but this, what you, what he just did is crushed you. You were just, you know, you're in the car, you're talking about a film that you liked, and you say some part of the film, and then somebody comes off the top rail and goes, "Nah, you missed the point completely," and they start saying their opinion, right? How do you feel, Brian, the rest of the day? You're just sitting there all frumped out. That's not fair. And that's what news does to us now. And that's what journals are doing to us now. And that's what, you know, mean people do to us. Distance yourself from that. You don't need that. Your ego system is fragile enough as it is. Just do me a favor, throw a fact in there every once in a while. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Make it a real story. Yeah. Take stock and, "Hey, are the words coming out of my mouth right now going to influence this in, in a bad way, or are they going to hurt somebody?" You know, you don't want to do that either.

Yeah. So I, I think that's kind of a good spot to wrap it up on. I just kind of get the points out of the, um, you know, the, the "fake it till you make it," right, is, um, I think in the right context...

Are you trying to tell me something, Brian?

No, no, that just burns too many calories. I'm just too crazy. I'm just like, "Hey, man, I have no idea what I'm doing right now. Where am I? What, what is it, what is that velvet? It's beautiful." No, but, though so, the "fake it till you make it," right? I, I think in terms of a positive outlook in some situations, it can be a good thing psychologically, sociologically, you're not doing any harm. That's like when somebody says, "Hey, how does this dress look on me?" "It looks great, baby!" Because you're in my room, and it's like, I feel really uncomfortable. Now I need an adult.

All right, man. Well, thanks, everyone, for tuning in. Please follow us on Instagram and Facebook. For those of you who tuned in on the Facebook Live, I appreciate your comments and stuff. We'll, we'll get to some more where we can take some questions live. Actually, if you're going to be around around this time, 10 a.m. Pacific tomorrow, we should be on here with a really, really cool guest. That'll be a fun conversation. But everyone else listening, hey, don't forget we also have the Patreon site. Don't forget to follow us along on social media. Please share it with your friends. If you've got a minute, scroll down there, give us a like, a thumbs up, or hit that five-star button if you, if you feel so inclined on your, uh, whatever podcast player. It helps get it out there. And actually, our guest, Greg, that we're recording tomorrow, found us because it popped up on his suggestions on Spotify. Which that's a good thing. That means, uh, and he liked it.

Well, it just means that, that I'll let you handle that. Our podcast was suggested to someone who actually then liked it. So, Brian and I are in this five-day mission with the day in, day out. So it's a seven days. We're, we're doing these brutal hours. And after building, a building a course, downloading stuff, and building something that has never, ever created before, you know, and so I believe it was Wednesday at like 1800 or something, and I promised Brian something, "I'll have the first cut for you by this time." My computer, now imagine seeing two images on it, and then it would shake, and then it would shake, and it would go dim. It was good, Brian. It was shaking. Oh my gosh, the first thing was I thought I was having a stroke. "911!" You know what I'm saying? "Is that better, Ryan, let's call him." And so he looked at it and he goes, "I don't know what that is, but that's [expletive]." You know? But not only, folks, did it take everything on the computer and just lock it out, it destroyed all of it. So we had to rebuild it again. So you talked about some scare. So what I'm trying to say here, if you're trying to reach me on my phone or my computer, I'm just learning typing out of my weight class.

All right. Thanks, everyone, for tuning in, and don't forget that training changes behavior.