Detecting a Cunning Opponent

All right, and we're started. Greg, happy New Year to you, and happy New Year to all of our listeners of The Human Behavior Podcast. Thanks for tuning in. This is the first podcast of the New Year. We had a great last year and hit some big milestones with the podcast, so thank you guys all for listening and sharing it with a friend. We appreciate that. That helps us out a lot.

So today, Greg, we wanted to start off this episode with a concept that we teach, in a sense that we have some courses named this, called "Detecting a Cunning Opponent." And there's a lot to get into with it, but the big overarching thing is, you know, part of it is when you want to know what you're up against, it's detecting something versus responding to something, obviously. And we call it a "cunning opponent" for a specific reason. We'll define some of these terms here in a minute, but the big idea is, we want to create a model, a simple way, whether you're using this at some large sporting event or a concert-type thing. It doesn't matter if it's individually, traveling with your family, you're in security, you're in safety, whatever it is, it's anything being around people.

And the obvious ones are easy to spot, like the guy walking down the street with a gun, or something's already happening. The difficulty is when someone is attempting to hide in plain sight, when they're a cunning opponent, versus just the guy who you can tell is waiting outside the 7-Eleven to rob people. When you pull up and you're like, "Oh, that doesn't belong here." That's not exactly the most cunning individual, right? So, there's a little bit of complexity in it, but the idea is detecting a cunning opponent is something we talk about in understanding the gift of time and distance, and how do we use our algorithms of B+A=D: the Baseline plus Anomaly equals Decision. We'll get into some of that in detail.

But, you know, we're kind of generally focusing around because when we teach this course, a lot of the time it is to event-driven security procedures and safety procedures. So, think of that big football game, the Olympics, something big like that, because there are a lot of people at these events. A lot of people tend to think that crowds in environments like that are kind of chaotic and unpredictable, and they're really not at all, especially when at a fixed location such as a stadium or something like that. It's actually designed in a way that they aren't unpredictable. You can only go and do so many different things in there, so most of them are actually already highly structured and semi-predictable behaviors, meaning you can predict what's typical. And then predict what are the likely things that you may encounter from a cunning opponent or something dangerous. But also things you may encounter just operationally. "Hey, the back delivery area is flooded, and now we have to reroute the trucks to some other area, which is going to affect other things." Right? So, there are certain things you can kind of plan for.

And what we want to do with this episode, especially, is give some examples of how we use our model to go from that big, seemingly chaotic environment of a lot of people, a big crowd, down to, "Okay, maybe a group of people," down to really it's the one or two or three, the small group of actors inside this scene that are actually there to do something other than what everyone else is there for. And typically that's some sort of crime or, in a worst-case scenario, some type of attack or terrorist attack or something like that, right? So, it's how do I go from this big, seemingly chaotic, unpredictable environment down to focus my attention where it actually needs to be? So we can do that with a repeatable model and stuff that we can use, we'll get into.

But first, Greg, I'd like to start by defining some of the terms. And so, for example, when we say opponent, opponent does not necessarily mean an enemy, right? It's just the other person. So, that could be the person, the opposing team in the game. It could be someone like a con artist. It could be your kid testing their boundaries, the bad actor in the crowd, a competitor, whatever. But opponent has a specific connotation versus like the enemy or the threat, because once I do that, it starts to limit what I think and how I see it. So, Greg, could you maybe start off with just opponent? What we mean by that on a street definition?

Yeah, so you said some great things there, and folks, get used to having a pen in your hand, recording the episode, jotting down notes, because you're not going to be able to use that stuff if you don't have it right at your fingertips. And it's going to take you time to rehearse, because we're talking complex environments. We're talking... and I would only add a caveat to everything that Brian said so far. I would say on my continuum we have zero to one person on the far left. In the middle, we have a small group, and on the right, we have a large group. So that's the only difference, because even Brian said, "you know, one or two or three people." Well, listen, you can encounter a cunning opponent when you're sending your daughter or son to a birthday party and the dad has a GoPro hidden in the bedroom. Okay, that's one person, do you get what I'm saying? With a remote device. You get what I'm trying to say? So let's not imagine that it's the Super Bowl every time. As a matter of fact, the Super Bowl is the perfect environment to test your skills, right? To build them so they'll work in small group and zero to one.

So, opponent. We equate it with enemy because we do the wrong thing. So we say "tactical and cunning," and we use those all the time. And a cunning opponent. So, a cunning opponent is a thinking opponent that's aware of their environment, that's going to utilize certain facets of their environment to gain an advantage, simply. Now, that could be a criminal advantage. That could be an opponent in a chess match. That could be a person that's trying to sell their flowers in City Market rather than the flower store next door, and get you interested in buying them. So the idea is that we have to understand the level of cunning that's at play and whether there's an intent-based cunning. So, an intent would mean that the person is trying to get you to buy the object for sale, or the intent is they're trying to get you a loan so they can predate you. That's hugely important.

So, opponent just means that every environment you enter into is competitive, no matter what the stakes, even if the stakes are small. And therefore, I have to make sure what type of opponent I'm seeing. Am I seeing an opponent that's just another person? We're racing shopping carts to get to the last goddamn can of peas, you get what I'm trying to say? Or it's a shoplifter and I'm between him and the exit. You see what I'm trying to say? So, those are much more important than the word opponent.

And then tactical. We've attached tactical to military and police. Tactical means ground level in street terms. It means boots on the ground at a place, at a time, and the surroundings that you find yourself in. Therefore, the baseline operational baselines are quite different. Okay, it's a different level, and strategic baselines are yet another complex level, right? So let's stick with those things that are immediately available to me in an environment. I'll give you a quick example: Surprise doesn't make a person cunning. Surprise is just an element of the environment. Now, if that person uses the element of surprise as a form of distraction, now you have a tactical and a cunning. You see what I'm trying to say? So, that level of complexity grows based on that.

So, a target-of-opportunity criminal? That doesn't necessarily mean cunning. That person looks around and says, "This computer's left on the front seat and the window's down, and I'm going to avail myself of that computer." There's a level of tactic. They've equated cost-benefit analysis with the environment and made the decision to go to the dark side. So, you have to consider all of that stuff before you ever leave your house. And those are the easy things. Those are the things you can do with your kids at the kitchen table, Brian. You don't have to flip tires and climb the rope and go to the gym to get good at these.

Yeah, and that's a great way to look at it. The cunning opponent: is this the person that was walking past my vehicle and happened to see the laptop, busted out the window, and took it to go steal it, or—

Or did they make it look that way because there's something extremely valuable on my laptop that's being exploited by someone, and it was espionage? You know what I mean?

I love it. I see exactly where you're going, and let's put a comparable there. It's winter here in Gunnison. I know it's winter where you're at, not so much when you lived in California, my brother. But let's put it this way for the New Year. So, there's a lot of what Colorado, I hate the term, calls "huffers and puffers," and it had nothing to do with dope. It's leaving your car running when you're running into a store. So, everybody here, there's a few stores that are open that early. So you've got Walmart, you've got City Market. Well, a cunning opponent is the one that's going to predate on that parking lot to take your car for a purpose. They're going to load it with dope and take it to another city. They're going to load it with humans and do trafficking. They're going to commit another crime by ramming it through a wall to get to your safe. The guy that just wants to get to Crested Butte to go skiing, okay? He's going to look and go, "Oh, warm car. Piece of candy." No cunning whatsoever. Do you get what I'm trying to say?

So, the idea is that you have to think in terms of what's the measurement? What's the... how do I equate what this is? And that helps you look. You know what your stakes are, even though they're small when you get into a chess match, right? When you're playing a Trivial Pursuit game with a table full of people over Thanksgiving, that's low-level stuff, Brian. But when you see that this person is trying to gain an advantage, you have to start thinking fast: "What advantage do they want to gain on me? And could it be criminal? Could it be nefarious?"

Yeah. And that's a good point, because a cunning opponent, if you're trying to be cunning, you're trying to gain some sort of advantage and stay undetected, or at least your plan remain undetected. It doesn't mean that you're trying to be undetected. Maybe you actually are, but you have some ulterior motive, right? And so if you think about it, "detect a cunning opponent," a lot of people who even listen to the show, they spend a lot of time themselves trying to be a cunning opponent, maybe so that they're not a victim or so they're not surprised, right?

So, if you think about it from this—this is an internal perspective, an external perspective as well. It's like, "All right, the things that you do to try to be a cunning opponent so that someone at a minimum goes, 'You know what? Not this guy. I'm going to move on to the next person and victimize them,' right?" So, some of this is stuff that you may do already implicitly, and that you or thought about it explicitly and decided to do that. But it takes on a different perspective from the opponent's perspective. And that's something we could probably should do a whole podcast episode on that. Like, you know, how we used to talk about thinking like an insurgent or thinking like that, because a lot of people really do get that wrong, where it's well-intentioned, but it's kind of like, "No, that's not how that works when you're a criminal," or "that's not..." So, but when it comes to cunning, you already have, what I'm saying is, you listening, already have likely some skillset in this, in applying this, yet we want to take that and build on it so you can identify someone else doing it.

Exactly. And so, here's the point again: stop thinking that it's dangerous in every application. So, it's misunderstood often as malicious. So listen to what Brian said: Brian said that cunning is the ability to gain advantage while staying undetected. So let's talk about undetected. Either you have to remain undetected, you as the human in the crowd of people or in the group of people. Yeah, distinction there. Size. Or the player has to remain... the pawn, the rook, the chess piece. Okay. Has to remain undetected. So, as it lingers, you forget about it. Now, that's going to come to play a little bit later. So, an IED was an example of an undetected enemy, right? "I'm going to put it on this travel route expecting most likely course of action that a young Marine is going to walk down there, a young soldier." You get what I'm trying to say? So, now we're demonstrating a nefarious intent, but not so in a game, but both player and piece have to remain undetected. So anytime somebody is trying to take steps, actively take steps, not lip service, take steps to remain undetected, you should be interested, and you should say, "Okay, what's the likely outcome of this act?"

So, let's jump into that then. Like, sort of like the mechanics of this. How does someone hide in plain sight? Right? How do they become a cunning opponent? And so there's a bunch of different elements that you can use, but there's some big ones that really that we get into a lot, but that are kind of common tools, I would say, or common things that are done, or common things that you'll see across. So there are things like access, which we'll talk about. Blending, like you already started about, like hiding in plain sight. Some sort of maybe manipulation, whether that's manipulating your attention, some sort of social engineering, creating distraction. And then timing, right? There has to be certain... there's an element of timing in all of this. Like you said, if we're talking about, like, bring up the Super Bowl, well, there's you get one chance a year at that, right? But even within a moment, there's a lot of that timing that comes to play. Like you brought up surprise, like, okay, was it because the element of surprise just occurred and emerged from the situation, or was it a planned moment of surprise? So each of these things have sort of their own way of doing things. And you brought it up too, even with IEDs, in a sense.

That first one being like access, and we say this very, like, it's a simple statement, but you really got to think about it, right? You always say this: "Look, I got to bring you to the bomb, or I got to bring the bomb to you." It's all about access. So meaning, I either have to gain access in some way, or I have to create access in some way if I don't have it. Meaning, like, there has to be a way to get that. And, yeah, that sounds oversimplified, but it's really not. So, could you kind of explain?

So, let's go, let's go way down the road again. Let's put boots on the ground and let's talk about Brian's experiences for everybody that's listening. Brian's a combat veteran, a decorated scout sniper with combat experience. So, he gained access to a cunning enemy with a bullet. He had a scope which allowed him to see an enemy at a great distance. Then he profiled their human behavior, discerned them as an enemy from a civilian population, and used the bullet to close the gap and neutralize the threat. Now, that seems like fancy talk, but think about it for just a minute. Okay, Brian brought the crime scene to the victim. So the idea is, Brian had to use access to get close enough to that person to destroy them, in that sense. So that's the same thing if you were playing checkers. In checkers, you have to have your piece close enough on the board to competitively jump targets, and you have to do it undetected, because if you're detected, the person will do counters, and then it becomes like a protracted game of tic-tac-toe where nobody goes anywhere. You get what I'm trying to say?

And on that one, thank you for using checkers, because I'm not a chess player.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Nor am I. Nor am I, but I see the pieces all the time. Right. When we were in Mexico City, remember using the chess piece as an example, and a guy had no idea what he was talking about. But the idea is, let's talk about that for a minute. So, the person that Brian brings up at a gas station that has the brand-new gas can, that comes over, "Hey, brother, can you spare a dollar? I'm going to get some gas." Okay, let's talk about that person. Low-level street urchin, probably zero danger. Okay, but how do they get to you? They can't yell at a distance, "You over there, come, come to me." Okay, that's not going to work at all, right? And so, how do advertisers do it? Well, we know red and yellow at a food store. That gets us thinking about, "Oh, you know, piece of candy."

So the idea is that I have to get something that's interesting enough to you that you'll close the distance and come to me, or I have to come to you. So the idea is, what steps do I do? And those steps will stand out against somebody that's just normally, clinically normally, going about their day. Normal people gain access by going up to a door and opening a door. They gain access to their car by opening their car door. They don't surreptitiously watch the door and then try it the first time to see if it's unlocked, then lie in wait for somebody to come in, swipe their card, and then try to sneak in the door afterwards. So those behaviors are above or below a baseline for access.

And you brought up a perfect example, that is something as benign as the person coming up and asking for money at the gas station. But one, they have access because you're stuck there at the pump and you're sitting there with your... you know what I mean? So they have, they, they, you, you can't go. But like you said, you can't, they're not going to call you over, they're going right up to you because they know you're right there, anchored at your vehicle. Then they're going to hide in plain sight. "Like, I'm going to come up with the gas can, the empty gas can, to point at it." Do this. "I'm going to use these different props or tools. I'm going to use some urban masking, social camouflage. I might manipulate or social engineer the situation. 'Oh, yeah.' Point to another car with some kids and 'those are my kids over there. They're starving.' Blah, blah, blah, you know." And that timing matters as well. They have to wait for someone, for that time when someone's stuck at their pump and they already start gas, because they can't blow them off because you're not going anywhere, right? So that's just like a perfect example of that, that sort of low-level way of, you know, that's a little bit of cunning in there, but it's nothing but, but it's, it's almost like the easy button, like it doesn't take a lot of thought for them to pull something like that off.

So that's why that person does it. Do you get what I'm trying to say? So, it's like being assistant crack... You look at the complexity of the situation that you find yourself in.

Horrible job.

Exactly. But that's, you know, back from the day when we were doing psychological breakdowns of people, everybody falls into a strata, a layer of their complexity in their environment, right? So, some people are bottom feeders, some people feed off the bottom feeders, some people are very aggressive criminals, right?

So, let's talk and Brian's four common tools of cunning were access and blending and manipulation and timing. So yesterday night, sadly, up in Larimer County, a mountain lion killed a female hiker. Okay. So, you know, it's the time. Why is it the time? Because they're pushed into areas that are commonly used by humans in residential areas and recreation areas. It's cold as a well digger's ass. The snow is deeper. It's harder to catch the animals. So, the animal had access. First of all, it's a park, okay, outside of Larimer County. Second, it blends in with its environment perfectly and silently. It steered the attention away by using distraction. Well, how did it do that? It laid silently in wait along a likely trail and didn't move, and it controlled its breathing and waited for the perfect possible timing, then exploited you walking under that tree or past those bushes, and you're distracted. You're looking at the beautiful environment, and, hey, we haven't had snow in a couple of days.

So, the idea, we give examples like snipers, insider threats, and we give examples of death and mayhem. Why? Because we're exposed to that all the time. But you don't need to be a goddamn mountain lion killing a woman outside of Denver. You're encountering a shoplifter that just wants to get away. You're walking up to get into your car with your groceries and somebody's already in it. Okay, those are the situations, right? And now that's where the element of surprise doesn't necessarily mean cunning, but it's just as lethal. It can get you killed just as much as a sniper and an IED.

Again, a mountain lion is a very cunning opponent because it's constantly... that's what it has to do for survival, right? Every single day it has to be cunning, down to, "You know what? I better go after that mule deer instead of this one, because that one put up a bigger fight, and I'm going to get my tooth kicked in, and then I can't eat and I'm going to die," right?

I mean, tell me that your guy with a gas can, Brian, out between Walmart and City Market, walking by the pumps, doesn't do the exact same assessment. Okay? And when I say exact, I mean within margins. They look at a person that's much more likely... "Hey, this guy's busy and he's in a hurry, and he just wants to throw the money at me to get me out of the way," rather than a person that's going to punch me in the nose or tell me to get a job, you know? Because every time I fail, every time that mountain lion fails, somebody goes hungry, right? So I need that money in my pocket. So I can't go out there and have a bunch of negatives each time that I do this because I'm not going to apply my trade very well. So the idea is that the cunning tend to get more cunning, and that's through exposure. And that's why we don't have a tactical advantage on the ground, is because if we don't study for it and rehearse and look at it, then we're going to likely be a victim more often than not.

Yeah. And like you bring up a good point too there. The cunning are going to get more cunning. Meaning if they are, if that is who they are, if they're just a normal person who's going to screw it up every time, they're going to screw it up every time. And it's like, I know I've told this story before when I was, you know, downtown Chicago years ago visiting some friends. We were out, and they come walking out of this nice place, and we're going to the next bar, and I was, you know, in the bathroom, whatever. So I come out after them, and there's a guy trailing them across the street, and then makes an angled approach to go over by them, and he didn't even see me. And I came up, and then he turned and looked at me, and I said, "Wrong group." And he turned and he just walked the other direction. So he knew, "All right, well, my gig is up. I no longer have the elements that I need. So I'm out of here." So, for him, he's going to learn and become more cunning. But like someone who just still did it anyway is like this guy who's just... you're not, meaning you, you're, you're, there's a learning, there's an advantage to learning from that and continuing to grow and become better, because you likely will, and you'll see that with people over time. So it's just a good example of that.

But, to determine some of this stuff, right, everyone wants the simple takeaways, and we talk about it over and over again, you know, the baseline plus anomaly equals decision. And it's still, everyone's like, "Well, what about this?" And so, I want to drill down a little bit deeper on that and kind of explain it the same way we do, but in a little bit different manner, just because you're listening to a podcast. Some of you are listening, have been through our training and come to our courses and seen a lot. Some of you haven't. You only know from the podcast, whatever. So, you know, I'm trying to cater, in a sense, to both audiences. I don't want the people who are always listening to, "Oh, yeah, you've talked about this before." And then the people who listen but have never been to training or don't know anything go, "Hey, what the hell do you mean by that? Because that sounds interesting," right? So, I'm trying to bridge that gap a little bit, but it's all good.

So, we talk about the baseline and how to identify. So, let's get into this detection method of how to detect a cunning opponent. And there's obviously way more than we could get into on a single podcast episode. There's way more that we can get into all of our podcast episodes, but it's a process I think that you can listen to this and then go out and try it, and we'll give you some examples, but here it is. It goes back to the baseline. And so this detecting message, let's start with just the literally the B.A.S.E. So, Baseline meaning, "All right, what's typical here? What are people here to do? What are you here to do?" Like the gas station example is perfect. You're there to either you work there, you're getting gas, or you're running in and getting, you know, a drink or something to eat or whatever, like, or you're delivering the gas or you're delivering the food and drink or you're delivering the ice for the ice. Like there are specific reasons to be there. So, it's like what in this environment, like most behavior, it's a short list, Greg, is that, I mean, like there aren't a lot of things that you can be doing. You don't just get up off your couch and wander down to the gas station for no apparent reason, right? We all follow some sort of goal-oriented behavior for whatever it is that we're doing.

So that baseline, it's that's actually where everything's at, right? That's where we, we, we really want to focus on because the better you get at that. But then you go, "All right, well then what's or who is demonstrating, you know, who isn't demonstrating that baseline behavior? Who isn't going along with these list of things of possible reasons or roles," I should say really, "like of why you should be there." So that's like the Anomalies: what's out of place, who's lingering, who's scanning, who looks like they're maybe conducting a reversal, a movement path that isn't aligned with what everyone else is doing, like the geographically challenged, someone who's lost. Everyone knows and has driven behind someone, you go, "Oh, this dude's lost," or, "Oh, they're lost." You know what that looks like. All right? So that looks almost universal because you're not following the path. You're putting your turn signal on, whatever, or you're braking when you shouldn't be. So you've driven behind that person. Well, that behavior demonstrates that they're lost. Well, that can see that in other areas. So, those repeated direction changes like targeting specific people, right? Our gas can guy at the gas station, right? Those are those anomalies that we look for, and those are just, what would you call them? Things that are interesting. They're invitations to pay attention to. Does that make sense, Greg?

Yeah, absolutely. So, if we add to that before we go on to the rest of them, what Brian is saying to you is infinitely important. So, you got to take stock in the baseline. So, when Brian was giving you, let's stick with gas stations, it's a perfect one. If you see a person that appears to be without a house and they're staying around the gas station, what would their demonstrations of intent be? Are they living there because they're living off of handouts? That they're living out of the dumpster? That it's warm? Okay? That it's got covered gas pumps so they're out of the weather? That the person doesn't yell at them and it's open 24 hours so they feel a sense of security? Those are all things that go on your yellow pad. That makes sense, right? And that comes up to that simple explanation. Okay. So, if I have a robust baseline, what are the people doing here? Any environment, I make a very short list of what happens in that environment. Then I take a look for who's paying attention and doing the baseline environments I should suspect and expect. And then who's out of place, who isn't.

Okay, I'll give you an example of an anomaly in a baseline. All gas stations I've ever been to have an ATM. And most of the ATMs at a gas station are the old draconian box method ones that have a little baby screen that you need your glasses with, and they'll only give out like 150 bucks, right? And it's really hard to read the son of a... but it's an ATM nonetheless. So, we all know what an ATM looks like and what the sign looks like. So, I've never had somebody follow me to the ATM. I've never had another male go with me to the bathroom. So, those would be anomalous behaviors in a clinically normal baseline. So, if somebody decides to shadow me in that situation, you know, I go up to get a beer out of the cooler and there's a person already waiting there, and they open the cooler door for me, "After you, sir." Well, either I'm in a high-end area, you get what I'm saying, or this doesn't fit at all. So, it's very simple to get used to seeing what doesn't fit. And what doesn't fit should make you more curious.

Yeah. Well, if it doesn't fit, you must acquit, right? You must figure out what...

He died, didn't he?

A lot of people died around—

A lot of people died with that.

A lot of people died violently around that mayor.

Holy—

I've never bought Isotoners for Shelley after that. Let's just go there.

Yeah. Guy was, I mean, but his hitch, I mean, his his rushing yards are pretty impressive. Uh, not, not enough to—

Not his, his post-NFL—

Kind of didn't balance out completely.

All right. So if we... your great explanation of what we mean by those anomalies and what they are like, "I got to pay attention to this." There's a meaning, it's just something more than, "Well, there's a, there has to be some reason for this," right? Like, there's a reason why someone isn't going along with that or they're doing something different. And so that brings us to like when I talk about the baseline and this BASE concept, the S would be what's the Simplest Explanation? Now, we teach that as MLMD (Most Likely, Most Dangerous course of action), but I figured I would kind of frame it this way, Greg, and we haven't really done it before, but we do it sort of implicitly because most things have this very simple explanation. I mean, almost everything has a simple explanation to it. Literally almost everything. More often than not, it is the simplest explanation. But that's the idea is that I want to start there. Not, "Oh my god, this is the next, you know, terror attack," what else should I... No, it's like, "What's the simplest explanation for what this person is doing?" "Okay, they're lost," or, "Yeah, they've never been in this place before," or, "They left their wallet in the car, which is why they're running back at you." I mean, there's, there's the most simple. So, and we would say that kind of like, "What's the likely thing?" because again, it can only be a few things. There can only be a few simple explanations. And so if I compare that to the, "What's the most likely? What's the most dangerous?" You know, that person lingering next to the Port-a-john at this event. "Are they waiting for a friend or are they waiting for a victim?" Right? It's like there's no other reason to hang out next to a smelly Port-a-john. Right? So, it's like you can only be there for a few simple reasons. So we always boil it down to what's likely and what's dangerous. And by doing that, I'm doing that active comparison. So, how do I do that in this gas station context, Greg? In a sense, you, like you were doing it, you were talking about it, but like—

Always default to your baseline. Always, always default to your baseline. Baseline plus anomaly equals decision. So, I'm taking a look at the situation that I find myself in, and I'm either alone and other complicating factors. The weather's bad and it's dark, and other complicating factors. I'm far away from the entrance. Okay. And I don't see a camera keeping an eye on me. I start adding those things up, and that Most Likely Course of Action starts becoming a more Dangerous Course of Action.

So, let's go the opposite end. I'm in line at an event, and nobody around me is attending to the surroundings. They're just waiting in line, and when somebody moves forward, they step forward. That means everybody's tuned out, which means, look, you're the perfect victim, okay? And that line now is at an entrance, okay? Or an exit to a place that does something, and then I add up that you're not in line and you're not doing the thing that we're all doing. Do you see how those things immediately fall into line when you're looking at your baseline and you can compare? Why? Because whatever you're susceptible or vulnerable, that's when you're higher likelihood that you're going to be predated upon. So, if you're standing in line for the bathroom and everybody's checked out and has to go pee, the last thing they're doing is, "Hey, why is this guy over here slinking up in the shadows to take an extra look at me? Why am I walking across the parking lot and this person is matching my, matching me step for step on the way to the elevator, you know, and it's after hours, and now I'm feeling uncomfortable?" Well, you feeling uncomfortable is because that's contra-baseline. That's counter what you should expect in that area, and that makes it an anomaly. So the idea is that if I'm seeing behaviors that are out of character for the behavior I should expect in that zone, guess what? It's taken itself from the simplest explanation—"He's here just like me to get in line and buy a ticket"—to, "Hey, wait a minute. This person's seen that I've got a couple extra twenties in my wallet, and I'm about to get robbed." The sooner you know that, the more that you can activate the gift of time and distance.

So, here's how we get to know that, because it gets into those situations. You brought up some good ones where a lot of times people don't know what to do, and when we're like, "Okay, well, that depends on what your role is in the situation, what your goal is, and all these," because that's what ultimately matters to all this, right? It's just even situational awareness in general. There's no just situational awareness. It's always relevant to the context that you're in and your role and goal in the situation, what the outcome is you're trying to achieve. There's no just, "Here's what it is." It's, "Well, that means this in this context, and this other..." But what people don't realize you can do is, and this is why we go through this process of the baselining and what we've been talking about today with this BASE, is that E would be Experiment. Do some hypothesis testing.

And so what we mean by that is, like, you can influence a situation. So, how would I do that? How could I, how could I experiment to see whether, which, whether or not my hypothesis is true? And well, there are a few ways. I can, I can change my perspective. I can literally move to another area and take another look. I can get a second set of eyes. I can say, "Hey, Greg, something over here. Can you take a look at it?" I can call someone. Whatever it is, I can do a contact, like, "Hey, how's it going, man? What's going on today? How you doing?" "Hey, can you tell me where this is?" and ask a question. I can report it. I can do all these things. But you even just talked about right there, like, "Hey, it's late at night. I'm in the parking garage. All of a sudden, this person's matching my steps." And people automatically go to that because they get this feeling like this isn't right. But they can't articulate why. But then they get victimized, and you're like, "Well, no. If you felt that, turn around, walk the other direction." "Oh, I left something in my car." And walk back and see. And then, and then now you're gathering more evidence. Either that person continues on with what they were doing, they didn't even realize you were there, or they're like, "Oh, now, now they have to react off of you." So now you've actually gained the tactical advantage in the situation, in a sense. So, so those are those things. So, as we're going through this, like, how does that work real-world with the things I just laid out, right? Changing perspective and getting a second look? What does that actually look like in these situations?

So, the idea is, jumping to an unreasonable conclusion burns calories that you don't need to burn. It also burns connections that you don't need to burn, because now you're in the "nutbook" at the local police department because you called 911 fifteen times in a day, and you don't want that. They call it sometimes the nutbook or the 96 book, and every agency has one even though they say they don't. Okay. So, the easiest thing to do is to change your perspective, change your location slightly. "I'm higher. I'm lower. I take a knee to tie my shoe. I get behind cover and do a quick peek. I walk into a store to see if that person continues to follow me," like you just said.

So, the second set of eyes is where I go, "Brian, at my six," (meaning behind me), "I'm not sure what's going on back there." But you automatically look at that and go, "Hey, I'm picking up that this guy's matching your pace." Or, you know, "I'm putting luggage on a cart to go into the hotel, and this person doesn't seem to have a rental car or any luggage, but they're damned, and they're not dressed like a porter, and they're definitely coming closer to me. So, what's up here?" Okay. Now you become a teammate. You become that extra set of eyes, my partner, right? We never go anywhere without that battle buddy.

Then the low-calorie contact. Brian told you one. Brian said he was in Chicago with his friends, and he yelled to the guy, "Hey, not this group." That's a beautiful one. You know, "Not today." "Hey, if you're not a cop, you better turn the other way and walk away because we're on to you now." You know, the jig is up, which means that I'm seeing what's going on. Now, those are the lowest-calorie contacts, but you don't always want to give away your advantage. So, that's when you report something. That's when you go in and you enlist the aid of another person and go, "Hey, do me a favor. Could you call the police for me? There's a suspicious person out in the parking lot." Notice I use this time "suspicious" because the person's no longer interesting. Now I have artifacts and evidence to support my conclusion. I'm not watching anymore, Brian. I'm not just watching and saying, "Wow, that's interesting. I'm curious." I'm now saying, "This person is up to no good. Do me a favor and call." And once you do that, now you become a good witness. I don't care what your rank is. I don't care if you're a cop or not. You become a better witness by putting these things in MLMDA (Most Likely, Most Dangerous, Action) fashion.

So you, you went to which is the next step, like kind of that in-moment action communication, because this is where it can get, it can get really difficult even if you have a lot of experience in this. You have a lot of like, even for like law enforcement who've been doing this stuff, and then you ask him a bunch of questions, like, "Well, I just knew." And it's like, "I had a gut feeling." And it's like, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you're right. However, you can't testify to a jury saying, "Well, I just knew." It's like, they're going to be like, "Get out of here," you know? I, but meaning it's, it's important to, to kind of distinguish between those two things, "Hey, between I didn't feel safe," or, "I felt scared," to, "Hey, I knew something was up," because those are a little bit different, and here's why. So that in-moment sort of communication, whether that's to yourself or to another person, that's a part that really needs to kind of where you, where the structure comes into play, right? And that's why we go to baseline, anomaly, why it matters, right?

Always go back to baseline. And one quick story to interject here so you understand that there's low-level Most Likely Course of Action, nothing's happening, you're fine, to MD, the Most Dangerous or Deadly Course of Action, and it's about to become from a crime scene.

So, yesterday was the anniversary of a female officer that was killed and a male officer that was shot so badly that he'll never return to duty. He'll never be absolutely like he was before the incident. And the call was a simple one: barking dog, a noise complaint. So, he went to the local hotel. There were a couple of dogs locked in a car that were barking, and it was bothering other people. They run the plate. They go in, find out what the hotel room is, knock on the door, female comes to the door. They said, "Hey, you got to stop this." The other neighbors, she's like, "Yeah, yeah, I get it." And they're like, "No, we got to talk to you. Get your name and information because if you don't do it, we're going to issue a ticket."

So, stop there for a minute, because you already know what's going to happen in any of my stories: it's going to take a goddamn exit to Wildtown. So, the idea was low-level, low complexity, no threats. Everything is simple. It's just a barking dog, Brian. It's just a barking dog at a hotel. So, somebody didn't do the baseline. What's the ML? What's the MD COA (Course of Action)? Why is this person refusing to give me the ID? It ends up that the person that's in the hotel room with this female not only is armed, but also has a warrant, thinks that this might be a ruse, okay? And comes out shooting. Ten shots are fired. Then, the female officer, after being shot at, disarmed, and killed with her own gun. There are so many tragic things that happen, but you know what happens? Like, I'm only on LinkedIn with goddamn social media. Everybody goes to, "Well, the tactics, and you failed this, and you did that." Look, your "hanky button" (metaphorical alert) should have gone off that you're at a location where sometimes bad people apply their trade. They have the dogs in the car, which means something. Okay, I'm not sure what it means yet, but now I go up and knock on the door, and I'm getting a little bit of resistance on a very low-level call from the person in the room. Do you see how things add up, Brian? And that's the key. The key is, why do these elements not fit very simply together? Why am I having a complex situation out of seemingly nothing?

So that, and that's a great example of a, of a, it goes where it goes back to the, the, the baseline and then the anomalies. So the baseline being like, all right, normally in this situation, people are doing what, and this person is doing this. I mean, because you think of like, "Hey, your dogs are barking in the car." This is like, that officer doesn't even want to be there for this call. That's how, you know what I mean? It's, it's such a, but, but meaning it's like—

So, let's go even further in likelihood. Brian, look, okay, for that person at the motel or hotel to call the police, has there been a number of complaints that that person couldn't handle? Because they almost never want to invoke the police card, right? And then the thing is, how long has the dog barking gone on? Look, you're at a hotel. They're noisy places anyway. So, for these dogs in the car to bark enough that not only you've exhausted management, but now they've called the police. Do you see that balancing act I'm talking about? If you took the extra minute on the way in the car when you're talking to the person at the front counter to start thinking this BAD (Baseline-Anomaly-Decision) is turning to an MD (Most Dangerous), then now you've got a chance. You've got a running chance at the gift of time and distance. And I'm not saying, look, I'm not casting aspersions. I wasn't there. I'm not that officer. But that officer's dead. Okay. And I can learn something from that situation, can't I? You know.

Yeah. And so it goes back to like, all right, so how, how you communicate that like in a moment. And right, we talked about the baseline. Normally people are doing this when here in this location. Normally I see this. This person is doing, you know, normally people are doing X, this person is doing Y. And, you know what? Here's why that matters. It's like, here's what's typical. Here's what I'm seeing. Here's why it's significant. So that gives them this, that could mean this. Normally I see this, that could be also this. Like, so it's like, "Hey, it's near this entrance. It's near this. It's where this is happening." So now the location matters. Now the request is whatever, "Can you send someone? Can you take a look? Can you do this?" Whatever that is based on the situation. But it's always that very simple, like, "Here's what's typical. Here's what I see different. Here's why, here's why I think it's significant here." You know what I'm saying? And by going into that as like, "This is how I'm going to report it," it forces you internally to actually justify what it is that you're doing.

To fill all those blocks. Exactly. So, even before you hit the number, look folks, if it's a bona fide emergency call, you can figure things out later, get it on the wire. But if it's not and it's very interesting and it's close to fitting all those things and you got to activate somebody, then this helps you remember those things that you have to do before you call. And it's always an area that's a transition area where the parking lot meets the forest, where the lights no longer shine on the other side of the hedge. Those are, you know, those are the typical things that you should be looking out for all the time.

That, that's that just spurred me, one of, one of one of my different cross-country drives. I think the last one was with my brother, but when it was, you know, stopping off right off a major interstate.

Yeah.

A busy gas station, parking lot behind the gas station, right up to a forest line that leads out into, like, I'm talking like middle of nowhere forest. And I'm like, "This is the greatest location for any type of illegal activity."

Homicides happen here. It's a sign. Like, you want to dump a body, you want to do a dope deal. There's two major interstates nearby. There's the... and it's just like you could come from nowhere and be instantly in the thick of things with people moving interstate traffic in zero time. It's like, it's like a portal almost. It's like some sci-fi movie. And it's the same thing going the opposite direction. So, when I see those certain specific locations, you're like, "Oh, Jesus. This is perfect for literally anything."

But I want to, I want to give a, do a couple, couple examples of how some of this stuff works, Greg. And talk about determining, you know, or finding or detecting a cunning opponent. And we'll start with something, maybe, I think your, your Greece trip.

Oh, yeah. Which I did not get to go.

Brian never got to go on that. Wonderful. Oh, I got such a sunburn, Brian, during the... and my massage was shortened because my—

So did I. So did I where I was at. And it was not because of fun.

I wasn't getting shot at. I was getting shots from the bar. No. So, we're doing MKOS and Chania and a couple other places and doing training. And so there's one riverfront that our program director for overseas operations, Martin Woolley, is very familiar with this oceanfront area. And so we go down there to take a look at a place for dinner. And clearly, I'm dressed differently and look differently than everybody else that's coming down there. And I look voraciously hungry at the same time. So what happens? A very simple plan. A guy steps in front of me to slow my roll. So I immediately catch on to that and try to turn to the left. And here's a guy with the placard with the menu, "Welcome to Fantasy Island!" Starts telling me all the stuff that they have. So I try to step back. There's another guy behind me, and I go, "Okay." So, I'm about to be either beaten to death, robbed, or these people want me to go to their restaurant. Now, every restaurant there was wonderful. So, why are they going so hard after me? Because my money is going to propel them past what they need to make their nut for that day. And if I just keep walking and choose another restaurant, they don't get it. So, were they aggressive? Certainly. Were they competitive? Absolutely. Did they show cunning? Yes. But the idea was they followed the acronym exactly, but it wasn't for nefarious means.

So, the baseline was a lot of restaurants, high-end stuff that was in there. The anomaly was all of a sudden these guys blocked my way. Simplest explanation fit. Most likely, they're trying to get me to eat at their restaurant. So I experimented. Okay. I tried a different restaurant with Martin. And then I asked Martin, "Hey, has this happened before?" He goes, "Oh man, that's how it works on these waterfront Mediterranean restaurants." So, do you see how quickly that went from a potential dangerous situation down to, "This is normalcy," and now it's something I can add to my file folders?

So, I had a fairly similar experience in, when I was, when I was with my wife, and we were on this years ago, down vacation in Cabo San Lucas. And so we were down in Mexico, and so same thing, we're coming down into this, like, the pier area where it's all restaurants and then tours and some shops and, and, and, you know, tourists walking down, and there are the boats right there. And then the same thing, they had the guys out there in front of each restaurant with their menus, just trying to get people to come in and spend their money at the restaurant. So, obviously, nothing nefarious. They're just trying to make it a big show and get in front of you to just literally block your path, so you're just kind of, "I guess we're getting some more chips and salsa," you know what I mean? Next thing you know, you're in there.

But, I'm coming down the hill, and it was like, come down this, this, the path basically where you can kind of start to see everything. And I had earlier in the day been having some drinks on the beach, some adult drinks, and had the, had the lady out there who was, you know, braiding hair for all the, all the girls on Spring Break, I guess. So I said, "Why don't we do it?" I had long hair at the time, longer than it is even now. And, uh, and so they did the braids and everything like that. So when Mikaela came down and she was like, "What the hell did you do?" I'm like, "Spring Break, baby. Let's do this." And so I got white girl wasted. Anyway, so we went down there. So I'm now walking through. I've got like a Hawaiian shirt on. I've got like, you know, braids in my hair coming down, and it was just, just me and my wife, and then everyone, and you could tell we were partying, having fun, and laughing, and like, you know, it was all other families going to restaurants and everything like that.

So, there are two guys though that are kind of off a little bit, pushed a little bit back from where everyone else was, and they're looking at the crowd, and I'm going like, "Okay, are these guys? They don't look like they're like, you know, playing close security for the area or anything." And I'm like, "All right, is that a manager watching their guys out here?" I'm not really getting that kind of feel. No one ever looks back to him. It's these two guys looking. And then the one guy, as we're walking down there, makes immediate eye contact with me, and both him and his buddy kind of like shift a little bit, and I'm like, "Okay." I'm watching. He comes walking right up to me. In perfect English, does the eyebrow flash and goes, "Hey, man. Can I get you anything?" And I'm like, "There you go."

I'm good. I'm good, brother. Thank you.

And my wife's like, "What the hell was that all about?" I was like, "Oh, he was trying to sell me drugs." And she's like, "What?" And I'm like, "Babe, stop. Look at me. Look at me right now. And look at everyone. Just take a look at everyone out here. All these families. Now look at me." She's like, "Oh my god, you look like you could use some cocaine right now." And I'm like, "Yes, I look like the guy that's going to come down there."

You fit the file folder, the mental model. You fit the expert model of what those folks were looking for. And that was a rare miss for them. And the same thing with the people at the restaurant. It would have been a rare miss if we continued to walk. And if Martin would have saved me and said, "No, no, man." And he knew, you know, some of the language and pushed him off and we went to another restaurant and it happened again. You see what I'm saying? So the idea of them being able to rehearse, meaning an opponent being able to rehearse and you not, that puts you at a disadvantage. So you upped your game, right? You changed and you got to see another part of the baseline, which now you've added to all your foreign speech dope trips.

Yeah.

I'm just saying, man. So he—

Well, it was actually good for my wife to see, too, because I was like, "All right, come here." And it was like a perfect teachable moment. I was like, "We walk past the crowd a little bit." I go, "Now look at where everyone's at. See the people in the house. See how those two are standing off? Their attention? They have situational awareness. They're up and out. They're looking at everything that's going on, right? Because they're looking for customers. They're looking for cops. They're looking for, for, you know, maybe even just a manager of a restaurant to be like, 'Hey, you know, pound sand, dude. Get out of here. Go sell your dope somewhere else.'" You know what I mean? Which they probably would have. I mean, these are younger kids. This wasn't like some, you know, but, but she was like, "Oh my god, how do you see all this stuff?" I'm like, "Baby, Jesus, like I do this." I—

Do you see how I'm teaching you?

She's like, "Yeah, that's what I do for a living, hun." But anyway—

When I go on those trips, I'm doing that. That's so funny. That's so true.

I'm not just out like partying or something. Like, where do you think I go when I'm doing this? But no, so those are those are two good, good examples. So I want to give the listeners kind of some, some, some homework or some things that they can do. And we'll do it, we'll do, let's do it two versions. Kind of like one by yourself, one that you can do with a team. And these are very, very simple things.

So, next time you're in one of those places, and I would pick places that you already frequent or somewhere that you go, right? And what you want to do is, obviously, all right, what are the baseline behaviors? What are the anomalies you notice? What could that mean? What, what are the hypotheses? What's, and, and do the, "What's the most likely? What's the most dangerous?" And Greg and I still technically do this. Remember, we're driving around, and Greg will go like, I'll, I'll pick something, and I'll give it either the most ridiculous, the most benign, where Greg will see something and be like, "Okay, yeah, homicide, body in the trunk, blah, blah, blah." And I'm like, "No, gym, you know, physics or high school physics teacher going to the..." And we just go like the two opposite diverging paths, just like to see which is more likely. And they're, they're, it's fun. But what it does is this is actually where, where, where interest comes from, like, meaning, your brain will actually start going, "Oh, I noticed a few things. I'm now interested in something that I other that I literally was not interested before in the past," right? You could, you can do that with music, and you take music you don't like and go, "Hey, listen for these three things." And then you'll hear it and go, "Oh." And then you'll start slowly liking that music more. It doesn't matter what it is. So, it's just training your brain. So, that would be, you know, one kind of solo one.

And then now I would, working in sort of like the team. It could be with your spouse, it could be with your whoever, someone else. It's like that communication part, like, "Hey, I'm down and up. I'm down and in. I need you to be up and out." Or, "Hey, nine o'clock, what do you see?" And so, how do I correctly? Because, you know, doing this stuff on my own, it can be easy. I can make some notes and I can see something, but when you start working with other people on it, it can get a little bit more complicated. So, Greg, if we're working together on this, how do I get you involved, but without like priming you in the wrong way or without—

Biasing you or putting my finger on the scale? You get what I'm saying? Like, because I want to get, I want to get a clean kind of observation from you. I don't want to suggest something.

Exactly. We're constantly aware of our surroundings and projecting the ML (Most Likely) and MD COA (Most Dangerous Course of Action) because we're always out in public. And guess what? Even us, we're sort of known to some people, and we stick out like a sore dick to other people. So the idea is that we don't want to become victimized, and the idea is that we project that so people are looking at us. And because most of the time we're walking and teaching somebody else, we're down and in. So we can't be up and out all the time.

So, one of the things that I do is when I'm walking and Brian's my up and out, what I'll do down and in, is when I see something that's encroaching upon me, access, I'll just call out a number. So, if you look at the face of a clock, 12 is in front of me, nine is behind me, or nine is my left, six is behind me, three is to my right, Detroit school system (referencing a common clock face teaching method). The idea is that as I'm walking, I'll yell out a number, and that's why it gets complicated, right? They'll yell out nine and the guy's at four. But, but—

This is, this is a good way for things to other use. If Greg is telling you, just assume he called out the wrong number.

Exactly. And look the exact opposite. No. And don't yell it out when you're close to a drive-through window because the guy back there is making a number for... But the idea is that you're yelling out the number where you see the thing. And all you got to do is say it louder than your conversation, and you can fit it right in a conversation so the people you're with don't get hyped up. And I do it with Shelley all the time. We're walking with Shelley, and I go, "My six." And she'll take a look at the six, or I'll say just the number six. And the idea is that she'll glance back there, and she'll say, "It's nothing." I can hear Shelley's voice now in my ear saying, "It's nothing." And the cool thing is that she's had the standoff, the gift of time and distance. She understands what's up. So, she did the MLMD COA that I couldn't do because I'm involved with something, and she told me it's all good. Now, if she doesn't answer or she says, "Yeah, this is a good one." Okay. Now, we start taking our defensive positions. We're calling somebody. We're getting 911 activated.

But I want to add something to that. That's the simplest thing, that quiet coordination tool, okay, in a crowd that nobody else is paying attention to. But Brian, if you're talking about a group skill, one of the greatest group skills in the world is using your binos, your spotting scope, your UAVs, those things to monitor your baseline. So if I'm on the move, I'm Oscar Mike (On the Move) through an environment, and somebody else can be surreptitious in their observations and perceptions of me moving through my environment, then they can talk to me in my ear and go, "Avoid the nine." You get what I'm trying to say? "Don't go over there. Stay in the parking lot. Don't go in the business. Something's up." And then now guess what? You're deconflicting potential danger at a distance.

Yeah. And obviously, with comms too, the brevity really helps when you do that.

Like when you turn you like, "Hey, you know, gray shirt, 2:00."

Yep.

It's not telling me, "I think he's doing this," or "this is something going on." And I look, and I either go, like you said, like Shelley doing the, "Ah, it's nothing," or, because what, and just so everyone understands, like that's when I do that or Shelley, someone does that, it's like, "Oh, I see what you see."

Yes.

"And I, I don't think it's anything," or "it's might be, oh, interesting," or "now I get a second look," or, "Oh, yeah, we're, we're going to make a U-turn up ahead. We're going to double back." We had it on New Year's. Shelley and I were driving away from a situation to go home. And all I did is look at my side view, look at my rear view, a few seconds apart, and I said two words. I said, "Same sled." And Shelley shifted from Shelley the passenger to Shelley watching the behavior of the vehicle. And said, "No, that guy lives down the street from us. You just don't recognize the vehicle." And I'm going, "Oh, thank you." But the idea was, I wasn't being paranoid. I wanted to add some precision to my observation. And so Shelley caught on right away. Why? Because we work together often. You and I work together often. Our teams do. So if now you find yourself at the Super Bowl or a big event, something like that, now you can use comms and optics and signal brevity and the BASE model to pick people out. It goes from "interest" to, "Hmm, something's going on here. Is it MLMDA (Most Likely, Most Dangerous, Action)?" And now I only have a simple choice. Who do I call? Okay. What do I know? Who needs to know? Have I told them yet? Very—

Yeah, and that's, that's a good point. I'm glad you highlighted that where it's one, when you're working with someone for a long time, and there's a lot of implicit communication and trust, and you know that, to now, to that's why I brought that up was reporting to someone that you haven't worked with, and it goes, "Hey,"

It starts off with, "Look, every time that you've been with me that I've had to call 911, and I know you because I've been with you a number of times where, because we're heightened and we're out there looking, we find things." Okay. And, and so the very first thing is I'll, I'll ask the person at the other end, "Do you have a non-emergency number?" And almost every time they either switch me to that non-emergency number or they say, "No, go ahead with your call." And I'll tell them, "Look, it's probably nothing." That's how I start off everything. "Yet I'm seeing these things in an environment where I normally see these things. So, it's probably nothing, but if you got a car close by, maybe they want to take a look at the person, you know, at the park bench with the blue briefcase that's doing the whatever." And I give a very detailed description. And you know what? I remain eyes on. I may shift my perception by moving to a position to cover. But I remain eyes on. And I also tell them my information so they can contact me later so I can be a witness. And you know what? I would rather, as a cop of 30 years, Brian, I would rather come to your house 10 times for nothing than come for the one time that across the street you were witnessing a massacre and nobody did anything about it.

Yeah, that, that's the thing is that this is where everyone goes, you know, whatever. You can, you can read the stories, you can watch the documentaries, whatever, like, "Oh, I knew something was up." And I mean, how many times it comes up where someone, "I felt off or something, I knew something here." And so this is what we're talking about is, is you can influence the situation too. So that going back to again what the baseline is, what the anomalous is, what's the simplest explanation? Can I conduct a limited objective experiment? Can I test my hypothesis in some way? Because then you're going to find out, is this a cunning opponent or is this not? Is this someone who's just going about their business and they're lost, or are they attempting to do something else? Because you know with that whole, when a cunning opponent is trying to keep it together and they're trying to hide in plain sight and they're trying not to be seen, that is difficult to do. It takes a lot of calories. It takes a lot of attention. It takes a... and you can only do it for so long, right? You can, you can only be like 100% on the ball, locked in, for a limited amount of time. So you're going to let something slip. Something is going to happen along the way that even no matter how well you train, rehearse, and plan for this attack you're going to go do or this thing that you're going to go have. Yep. There's going to be something that if it gets in your way is going to trip you up enough that you will betray your affiliations. You will demonstrate your true intent. You can't just hide from everyone all the time. It's impossible to do.

It's so true. Look at that female that attacked that church school on the East Coast that parked in a very interesting manner, then drove around in a very interesting manner, then got out all of her guns in a very interesting manner. Still not triggering anybody, but then she shoots out the front window door and then never tried to get in with the long guns and guns strapped. So, she's trying to get under the door and drag her stuff, and she got caught a couple of times, and it looks so awkward. Okay. Well, we know immediately what she didn't rehearse and what she did rehearse, right? So, the idea is that when you take a look at that, that level of cunning, that level of expertise, you can play that back all the way to the parking lot and before, because guess what she had to do? She had to pack those guns and then she had to lift them into the trunk or the back seat, and she had to do those things. So, you can assume that that level of the game is already known. So, you play it backwards, and you know what? Cunning means you can be a cunning opponent, and that means that you're harder to kill. You're smarter and faster.

Brian and I, last thing I'll say, Brian and I were in a parking lot, and we were on the way to training, and we were with another person that doesn't do what we do all the time. And the first thing that caught my attention was at my nine (o'clock), which I'm doing the numbers real quick now because I don't want to be an idiot. I actually pointed, "Did you see that?" And Greg, Greg wears a watch that doesn't work. It just has the numbers and it's drawn on with Magic Marker. So, the idea was that the car was parked off the regular hotel parking. So it was behind some things on the way to the goddamn closed restaurant next door. Remember that restaurant had like operating hours 1:00 to 2:00, you know what I'm saying? It was like closed almost the rest of the day. But the female was at the trunk, and she had literally everything out of the trunk. She had the thing that holds the spare tire, the spare tire, the jack for the spare tire, the jack handle, all the other bags and things that were in the back, but all four tires were perfect. And that wasn't what she was looking for. She's still digging down in the fender wells. Okay, why is that interesting? Because again, a location where somebody plies their trade. Who was in that trunk? What was in that trunk? What was she about to put into that trunk? Okay, those went immediately from an ML (Most Likely) in my mind to an MD (Most Dangerous). And I don't know the level of the D here, okay? But it was interesting enough to me to bring Brian's attention to it. And then we tell people that because we were training a bunch of cops that are from the area, so they knew, and we took photos to back up artifacts and evidence to support. So now it's out of our hands. Now we've done the reporting part.

Well, a little bit after that, the person that was uninitiated, that hadn't gone through the training, that didn't do that, goes, "Hey, so what was that all about back there?" because they never equated that location with that behavior with a sense of D (Danger). Okay? And so that's why you have to do this often. That's why you can't just go on a webinar or study a book or do. You have to get out on the ground, Brian, and you have to practice it. That rehearsal is just as important for us as it is for a bad guy.

Yeah. And we're, you know, well, one of the things we're lucky because we're traveling and always in those—

All the time, transition areas. The area or areas where there are transient people. I don't just mean like homeless people or something, meaning literally, like if you're coming and going out of these hotels, and where they've got, especially the areas with like four hotels together, it's like, "Okay, like this is all people not from this area here for a specific purpose." So, what is their purpose being here? Is it business? Is it, is it pleasure? Is it which means it's Christmas in July for some lucrative, you know, uh, and, and the other thing is, look, people that hire us don't often take us to the top of the bunch and give us lobster. We're going to areas where there's trouble, right? So, that means that we see those things. And the idea is, you can see them, too. You just got to slow your roll. You just got to look around. Being situationally aware takes a lot of time to get good at.

And then the people that could afford to take us those places always want us to show them the grimy stuff. No, take us, take us to that nice restaurant you were talking about.

Exactly. That's so true. I'm thinking of names. Names are popping into my head right now. You know, we, I'm not going to attribute them, though, Brian.

Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure we're thinking some of the same ones, but, um, all right. So, we, we, we, we went over a lot, and, and we covered at the beginning this "Detecting a Cunning Opponent." And again, this is, this is important too, because especially like go back to the large event stuff, like there's a difference between, you know, whatever, the kids who are trying to sneak in to see the concert versus the person who's trying to plant a bomb at the concert, right? And so like this is—

But guess what? In order to gain access, they might do the exact same things. Now, one is not as big of a deal. It's still maybe a crime and they can, you know, have to get kicked out, but the other one is catastrophic, right? So, if you can catch a shoplifter, you can catch a body bomber. That's the key. If you can catch a person that's going to steal that car idling in the parking lot, you can find a sniper in a complex environment. It's the same skill. And we've proved that. We proved that over and over and over. Not just in combat, not just with the Marine Corps and the Army and with J.C. and everybody else, but we've proven that with law enforcement, and we've proven that with private sector. So, the idea is you have to do your work. Nobody comes up and goes, "By the way, I'll be your murderer tonight." You have to use the work, do the work, and you have to rehearse, and you have to practice. And guess what? Just like going to the gym, Brian, this stuff sticks. It will show. In a very short time, you'll be able to do this.

All right. Yeah, I think those are some good final thoughts there. Unless you have anything else on this one, Greg?

I got nothing. I'm still shamed by the face of the clock. That beat my ass today, just so you know. You know what I'm saying? Telling time is kicking my ass, folks.

It, it is. Which direction is that? Exactly. From now on, I'm just going to point and grunt.

Yeah. Or, well, you get, "Oh, no. I meant from year seven." It's like, "Oh, okay. I'll go in the crowd and hold up the guy like the jerk. It's the oil cans. This guy hates the oil cans." Oh my god. Folks, just listen to Brian. He's smart, aren't I? So, so we covered a lot, but if there's more on the Patreon side, and we'll give some, some outlines for that stuff for those who couldn't take notes, but thank you all so much for listening and tuning in. Please keep reaching out with some of your questions or things you want us to discuss so we can get them on here and on the Patreon site. And we're looking forward to 2026. I hope everyone had a great 2025 and a good New Year's and holidays and all that. So, we thank everyone so much for tuning in, and don't forget that training changes behavior.